UmbralRaptor changed the topic of #kspacademia to: https://gist.github.com/pdn4kd/164b9b85435d87afbec0c3a7e69d3e6d | Dogs are cats. Spiders are cat interferometers. | Космизм сегодня! | Document well, for tomorrow you may get mauled by a ネコバス. | <UmbralRaptor> egg|nomz|egg: generally if your eyes are dewing over, that's not the weather. | <ferram4> I shall beat my problems to death with an engineer. | We can haz pdf
<kmath>
<✔Alex_Parker> When all you have is a hammer, everything looks like a nail. ⏎ ⏎ When you have a space-qualified Hand-Actuated Manual… https://t.co/IhSSitJq5k
<raptop>
!8 Steal the El Blanco telescope, and stick a clone of NEID on it?
<_whitenotifier-31f>
[Principia] eggrobin closed pull request #2359: Bring the notation in elliptic_integrals.{hpp,cpp} in line with the papers - https://git.io/JeB2l
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<mofh>
egg|work|egg: feel free to templatize it yourself, I just split the functions up and I actually wouldn't know how to do that the "properly C++" way >_<
<egg|cell|egg>
Mofh: you could learn
<egg|cell|egg>
Also you'll want to pick up the notation changes
<egg|cell|egg>
Otherwise it will be hard to make sense of the code
<mofh>
yeah, moment.
<raptop>
!wpn -add:wpn baguette
<galois>
Added wpn 'baguette'
<raptop>
!wpn -add:wpn bagel
<galois>
Added wpn 'bagel'
<raptop>
!wpn -add:wpn crossant
<galois>
Added wpn 'crossant'
<raptop>
!wpn -add:wpn crescent
<galois>
Added wpn 'crescent'
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<egg|zzz|egg>
!wpn whitequark
* galois
gives whitequark a cupric quadrilateral
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<galois>
[WIKIPEDIA] Formules trigonométriques en kπ/7 | "Cet article présente des formules trigonométriques correspondant à des angles multiples de π/7.…"
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<egg|cell|egg>
Mofh: meow
* egg|cell|egg
pokes mofh with anbo
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<kmath>
<tsplanets> For contrast, here are these moons to scale based on their actual sizes, not apparent sizes from Voyager 2. https://t.co/3lTgqjWjXE
<SnoopJeDi>
egg|work|egg, mofh are you aware of any Unicode guidance on what constitutes a "word" character? I noticed that the Python docs for the `re` module say that the default behavior of \w (i.e. without the ASCII or LOCALE flags) matches "Unicode word characters," but this doesn't seem to actually be a thing?
<SnoopJeDi>
it looks like the regex engine the interpreter uses expands this test to alnum + '_'
<egg|work|egg>
The Python docs are usually sloppy, but there are the Letter General Categories
<SnoopJeDi>
yea, and alphanumeric is defined as a union of categories somewhere, right?
<egg|work|egg>
no mention of "alphanumeric" except in "ASCII alphanumerics" though
<SnoopJeDi>
hmmm
<raptop>
!u ç
<galois>
ç: U+00e7 LATIN SMALL LETTER C WITH CEDILLA
<SnoopJeDi>
it does mention \w though
<egg|work|egg>
The class of <word_character> includes all the Alphabetic values from the Unicode character database, from UnicodeData.txt, plus the decimals (General_Category=Decimal_Number, or equivalently Numeric_Type=Decimal), and the U+200C ZERO WIDTH NON-JOINER and U+200D ZERO WIDTH JOINER (Join_Control=True). See also Annex C: Compatibility Properties.
<SnoopJeDi>
aha!
<egg|work|egg>
but that's one possible definition of word character
<egg|work|egg>
To meet this requirement, an implementation shall extend the word boundary mechanism so that:
<SnoopJeDi>
yea, but even then, I'd rather see the docs link to something actually useful to interpret what the hell it means
<egg|work|egg>
but there's another definition
<SnoopJeDi>
The one in the annex, you mean?
<egg|work|egg>
> To meet this requirement, an implementation shall provide a mechanism for matching Unicode default word boundaries.
<egg|work|egg>
The simple Level 1 support using simple <word_character> classes is only a very rough approximation of user word boundaries. A much better method takes into account more context than just a single pair of letters. A general algorithm can take care of character and word boundaries for most of the world's languages. For more information, see UAX #29,
<egg|work|egg>
Unicode Text Segmentation [UAX29].
<egg|work|egg>
SnoopJeDi: I mean that Unicode standard annexes generally give you a bunch of options for the way you define things
<SnoopJeDi>
Yea, which is why I found "Matches Unicode word characters" very unspecific
<SnoopJeDi>
since there's often more than one way to do it
<SnoopJeDi>
egg|work|egg, the specific case was someone asking why \w doesn't match &
<egg|work|egg>
which means that saying "we use the one that Unicode says" is not a definition unless you say things like "we conform to RL2.3 of UAX 29 version something"
<SnoopJeDi>
and the pragmatic answer was "if that's considered a word character in your locale, use the LOCALE flag"
<SnoopJeDi>
yea, exactly
<SnoopJeDi>
okay, I'll open an issue on their tracker and link to TR18. Thank you very much, I appreciate the expert advice
<SnoopJeDi>
I've only reached the level of understanding that I don't understand Unicode, but haven't yet mastered how to poke around the leviathan to find the parts that might be relevant to whatever question I'm interested in :)
<egg|work|egg>
Note: I have not read UTS 29 recently
<egg|work|egg>
You should
<egg|work|egg>
you should make sure that they don't say something that implies & is not a word character ever
<SnoopJeDi>
oh they definitely don't in the docs
<egg|work|egg>
"they" being Unicode
<egg|work|egg>
not Python, the Python docs are useless
<SnoopJeDi>
an unfortunate truth
<egg|work|egg>
but it's not very useful to file a bug asking them to do something against which Unicode should recommend
<egg|work|egg>
so you should figure out what Unicode recommends
<SnoopJeDi>
I've had this frustration enough recently that I finally got over the activation energy threshold to make an account
<SnoopJeDi>
I'm just not sure if that actually comes from Unicode guidance of any description (it seems compatible with TR18's <word_character> here), or if it's just kinda...whatever
<egg|work|egg>
well you can read the doc and figure that out
<SnoopJeDi>
(whether or not anyone with commit ACLs will care about this, OTOH...)
<egg|work|egg>
Punctuation, other
<SnoopJeDi>
yea, I told the user who brought up the question about that, it made them grumpy :)
<egg|work|egg>
so that's not a <word_character> for an implementation conforming to RL1.4 Simple Word Boundaries
<SnoopJeDi>
yea I'm guessing that's the one the original author of the comment meant, but will make sure I understand the alternatives before I submit the issue
<SnoopJeDi>
raptop, do you hang out on that scicomm server? I didn't realize Mastodon had any communities dedicated to it, but that certainly piques my interest
<raptop>
SnoopJeDi: not right now. I've been meaning to setup an account
* UmbralRaptop
's enthusiasm is pretty much restricted to driving manual these days
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<egg|zzz|egg>
SnoopJeDi: boring technicality: it doesn't define <word_character>, rather it says that an implementation meeting the RL1.4 (Simple Word Boundaries)
<egg|zzz|egg>
requirement should look for boundaries between a <word_character> and a non-<word_character>, where the class <word_character> should satisfy the property described in RL1.4 (1).
<SnoopJeDi>
ah, I see
<SnoopJeDi>
egg|zzz|egg, do you grok what "extend the word boundary mechanism" is referring to? Any specific mechanism, or just [whatever the engine does for word boundaries]
<egg|zzz|egg>
SnoopJeDi: (and not simply look for that, but also satisfy (2))
<egg|zzz|egg>
the mechanism that finds \b
<SnoopJeDi>
gotcha
<egg|zzz|egg>
extend the "very simple mechanism for determining word boundaries" to quote 1.4
<SnoopJeDi>
well, we'll see if anyone cares to either shed light on why its worded so weirdly, or greenlight writing it less vaguely
<SnoopJeDi>
interestingly, the `regex` module supports the \p syntax!
<SnoopJeDi>
which I'd never even seen before, but it's lovely
<SnoopJeDi>
I guess I should have used the word "constrains" instead of "defines," but I'm glad to have not muffed up the broad point
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<_whitenotifier-31f>
[Principia] TransparentElemental closed issue #2360: Check failed and game instantly closes, didn't happen yesterday - https://git.io/JeRtd
<_whitenotifier-31f>
[Principia] TransparentElemental commented on issue #2360: Check failed and game instantly closes, didn't happen yesterday - https://git.io/Je08U
<egg|laptop|egg>
mofh: how did you manage to make our elliptic integrals work btw? they depend on the polynomial evaluators which pull in quite a lot of stuff
<SilverFox>
is the whole algebraic substitutions thing I hear about the same as when we substitute units in physics?
<egg|zzz|egg>
s/mofh/mofh_
<egg|zzz|egg>
which mofh should I be pinging
<mofh>
egg|laptop|egg: I spent a *lot* of time trimming down your polynomial evaluators to ones that wouldn't
<egg|laptop|egg>
mofh: ah
<egg|laptop|egg>
mofh: you're using it in C++, or rewriting in FORTRAN?
<egg|laptop|egg>
!choose fix the sign bits|templatize to avoid computing J
<galois>
egg|laptop|egg: Your options: fix the sign bits, templatize to avoid computing J. My choice: fix the sign bits
<egg|laptop|egg>
;choose fix the sign bits|templatize to avoid computing J
<kmath>
egg|laptop|egg: fix the sign bits
<egg|laptop|egg>
mofh choose fix the sign bits|templatize to avoid computing J
<egg|laptop|egg>
stabbity choose fix the sign bits|templatize to avoid computing J
* UmbralRaptop
doesn't know what J is, so I'll assume that for some reason Outlook is sending mangled smilies to Principia
<egg|laptop|egg>
J is Fukushima’s associate incomplete elliptic integral of the third kind
<UmbralRaptop>
aaaaa
<UmbralRaptop>
fix the sign bits
<mofh>
egg|laptop|egg: templatize (or just split up)
<egg|laptop|egg>
mofh_: but the sign of 0 is wrong tho
<kmath>
<capsule_169> "I was a mortal being once, too," the angel mused. ⏎ "A human?" I asked. She shook her head. ⏎ "No. What ruled the Eart… https://t.co/KsP9c2daJr
<egg|laptop|egg>
mofh_: splitting it up would replicate a lot of messy code
<mofh>
egg|laptop|egg: then that's a 1-line fix so fix that first :p
<egg|laptop|egg>
mofh: no, the sign of 0 would probably be done by making geometry::Sign know about the sign bit (ideally via intrinsics), so it's a bit tricky
<egg|laptop|egg>
mofh_: how does the performance compare with whatever you were using earlier?
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<_whitenotifier-31f>
[Principia] eggrobin opened pull request #2362: Templatize on the need for the integral of the third kind - https://git.io/Je0Bw
<mofh>
halp while looking thru Principia/numerics I stumbled across your commit message of "They're good root finders, Brent" again and now I can't stop laughing.