UmbralRaptor changed the topic of #kspacademia to: https://gist.github.com/pdn4kd/164b9b85435d87afbec0c3a7e69d3e6d | Dogs are cats. Spiders are cat interferometers. | Космизм сегодня! | Document well, for tomorrow you may get mauled by a ネコバス. | <UmbralRaptor> … one of the other grad students just compared me to nomal O_o | <ferram4> I shall beat my problems to death with an engineer.
<Grayduster> egg: You're probably already aware of this, but just checking anyway :) The catalan release of principia's readme still links to the cartan binaries.
<egg> oh shit
<Grayduster> Ok, guess not :)
<Qboid> [c2202] title: Update README.md by Pascal Leroy | Additions: 1 | Deletions: 1 | https://github.com/mockingbirdnest/Principia/commit/c22020ae77a2fd6c27f342411776c8988d7bfb96
<egg> Grayduster: where do you see a link to the old binaries
<Grayduster> egg: That commit was 9 days ago - I grabbed the release package, which was 14 days ago
<egg> ah but the official release was on the new moon
<egg> we created the tag before, but note that this wasn't announced until the new moon
<egg> and the date in the tag is that of the new moon
<egg> if you don't wait for the new moon you may be eaten by a werenewton
<Grayduster> Uhhuh.
* Grayduster backs away into the darkness
<egg> Grayduster: the next release will be Cauchy, scheduled for the new moon of lunation number 216; that's 2017-06-24T02:31 (UT1)
<egg> Then Cayley, then Чебышёв (on a total egglipse!)
<egg> Cesàro, Chasles, 陈景润, Chevalley...
* ExtinctionRaptor ? the sky above the CFHT.
<egg> ExtinctionRaptor: CFHT?
Grayduster has quit []
<ExtinctionRaptor> !acr -add:CFHT Canada France Hawaii Telescope
<Qboid> ExtinctionRaptor: I already know an explanation for CFHT! (Update it with !acr -update:CFHT Canada France Hawaii Telescope)
<ExtinctionRaptor> CFHT?
<Qboid> ExtinctionRaptor: [CFHT] => Canada France Hawaii Telescope
<egg> hah
<egg> ExtinctionRaptor: what's with its sky?
<ExtinctionRaptor> Extinction is weirdly complicated around red/near IR
<egg> eggstinction.
<SnoopJeDi> w a t e r
<SnoopJeDi> (probably?)
<egg> ExtinctionRaptor: have you tried stabbing the atmosphere
* SnoopJeDi ? that commit message
<ExtinctionRaptor> SnoopJeDi: Nah, too blue.
<SnoopJeDi> maybe I'm thinking of smoke columns, then
<ExtinctionRaptor> Like 500-1000 nm
<ExtinctionRaptor> Not even J band,
<SnoopJeDi> (or heavy water which has a shifted spectrum apparently?)
<egg> uh why do you have heavy water clouds above your telescope
<ExtinctionRaptor> Accident at the nuclear plant. Blame Canada.
egg is now known as egg|zzz|egg
<egg|zzz|egg> ExtinctionRaptor: hmm should I df a bit before zzzing
<egg|zzz|egg> ExtinctionRaptor: ow, missed the catstream https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zLIaJBqcjNI
<kmath_> YouTube - Feiyu Gimbal Serial Hack - scanlime:021
<egg|zzz|egg> ah, wasn't a stream?
<ExtinctionRaptor> Does Tuco still exist?
Snoozee is now known as Majiir
<egg|zzz|egg> ExtinctionRaptor: why wouldn't it?
<egg|zzz|egg> ExtinctionRaptor: latest tucopic: https://twitter.com/scanlime/status/870692464981454850
<kmath_> <scanlime> https://t.co/7yWbG5nvyl
<egg|zzz|egg> !wpn Majiir
* Qboid gives Majiir a Venusian birb
<egg|zzz|egg> ExtinctionRaptor: also https://mastodon.social/@scanlime/7765003
<Majiir> Birbs on venus!?!!
<Qboid> Majiir: SilverFox left a message for you in #kspmodders [24.05.2017 10:23:36]: "https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1FPk9APKoVs"
<egg|zzz|egg> Majiir: not sure what they're made of
<egg|zzz|egg> !wpn Majiir
* Qboid gives Majiir a ε-δ Bucket O' Nitrogens™
<egg|zzz|egg> !wpn Majiir
* Qboid gives Majiir a plutonium asterism-like theorem
<ExtinctionRaptor> !wpn Majiir
* Qboid gives Majiir an isothermic pilcrow/чертовщина hybrid
<Majiir> hat
<Majiir> .hat
<Majiir> !hats
<Majiir> !hats
<Majiir> .hats
<Majiir> @hats
<Soozee> Unknown command, try @list
<ExtinctionRaptor> .hat
<Majiir> I tried that one
<ExtinctionRaptor> er, right. #bottorture
<ExtinctionRaptor> No hatbot in here.
<Majiir> D:
* ExtinctionRaptor chooses to believe that Qboid found The Devil's Pilcrow.
* ExtinctionRaptor ponders what to do with current extinction calculations.
<ExtinctionRaptor> (It's using a constaint exp(-0.11*airmass) across all wavelengths, where airmass is modified by an isothermal atmosphere w/ a scale height of 8400 m)
<ExtinctionRaptor> It looks like from data taken at UT-austin, I can fit a constant opacity of 0.1 combined with a "rayleigh" part that scales with wavelength^-3. Not sure about the CFHT, given that it hits a plateau of around 0.1 at somewhat bluer wavelengths, and then falls off around 600-900 nm.
<ExtinctionRaptor> I'm not planning on doing a model that takes into account all the molecular dipoles, vibrations, absorption lines, dust, ...
* ExtinctionRaptor is tempted to go with the UTA paper's data, since that can be fit easily, and just warn about not trusting it completely, especially beyond ~350-950 nm.
<egg|zzz|egg> ExtinctionRaptor: just get rid of the atmosphere
<ExtinctionRaptor> egg|zzz|egg: One of my advisor's projects may involve that.
<egg|zzz|egg> ah good
<ExtinctionRaptor> (Okay, just a high precision radial velocity instrument in orbit. But still...)
<egg|zzz|egg> ExtinctionRaptor: that seems inefficient, you should get rid of the atmosphere for everyone
* ExtinctionRaptor should see about uploading some graphs.
* ExtinctionRaptor stabs macbooks in their lack of RJ-45 jacks.
* ExtinctionRaptor stares at their basically expended data plan.
<egg|zzz|egg> ExtinctionRaptor: I think it's host based?
<egg|zzz|egg> so when your ip changes it loses your hats probably
<egg|zzz|egg> .hat
<egg|zzz|egg> uh
<egg|zzz|egg> wait I responnded in the wrong channel didn't I
<egg|zzz|egg> Majiir: 6
<egg|zzz|egg> s/6/^
<Qboid> egg|zzz|egg meant to say: Majiir: ^
<Ellied> ExtinctionRaptor: a good threat for a macbook would be "I'm gonna rip you an RJ-45 jack"
ExtinctionRaptor is now known as ExtinctRaptor
<egg|zzz|egg> !wpn ExtinctRaptor
* Qboid gives ExtinctRaptor a holographic door
* ExtinctRaptor stares at the door.
* ExtinctRaptor pokes the LHC with an orb.
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<Ellied> Large Orb Collider
<Ellied> !wpn egg|zzz|egg
* Qboid gives egg|zzz|egg a quintic haloalkane
<ExtinctRaptor> That sounds like it has very exciting chemistry.
<ExtinctRaptor> !wpn
* Qboid gives ExtinctRaptor an infinite kindle
<SnoopJeDi> Ellied, good lord that "first day" nightmare-fuel tweet
<Ellied> which?
<SnoopJeDi> the junior who wiped a production DB
<Ellied> oh yeah
<Ellied> a great many people ought to be fired over that and none of them are the newbie.
Majiir is now known as Snoozee
<SnoopJeDi> ...huh. I did not realize that Julia allows UTF-8 variable names.
<SnoopJeDi> That's...a *really* compelling reason to use it.
<SnoopJeDi> but then, I guess there's no shortage that in Prinicipia, either
ExtinctRaptor is now known as UmbralRaptor
<egg|zzz|egg> SnoopJeDi: I see you can't spell that either :-p
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<BPlayer> Hi!
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<egg|zzz|egg> !wpn Iskierka
* Qboid gives Iskierka a panzer explosion
<kmath_> <barrelshifter> a battle for the ages https://t.co/wFxho3e0v1
<kmath_> <barrelshifter> entangled in the violence of war https://t.co/aMPqYVJ6MC
<egg|zzz|egg> !wpn whitequark
* Qboid gives whitequark a flail
<egg|zzz|egg> !wpn Sarbian
* Qboid gives Sarbian an invertible breadboard
<BPlayer> Egg? Let's do another heavy maths session?
<egg|zzz|egg> sure, ask away
<BPlayer> So, let me clarify if I understood the concept - I need to "simulate" the vehicle in physics ticks, and calculate every tick with a Runge-Kutta integrator. Right?
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<egg|zzz|egg> yup
<egg|zzz|egg> (this is because Runge-Kutta methods are one-step methods, so you need only the result of the previous step; you have multistep methods, stuff like Adams-Moulton and whatnot, that depend on k previous steps, but let's not get into that right now)
<BPlayer> Now for the actual maths
<egg|zzz|egg> BPlayer: now there is another question, which is choosing the size of the step
<BPlayer> Oh, I can take care of that
<egg|zzz|egg> this is tricky, and ideally you want an algorithm that chooses the step size for you
<egg|zzz|egg> no, it *is* tricky, don't dismiss the trickiness :-p
<BPlayer> I figured I might try to plot the results as Y for a step of X
<BPlayer> And then I get a curve which I might try to extrapolate
<egg|zzz|egg> yeah you can do convergence plots
<BPlayer> So I don't think the time step would be an issue here.
<BPlayer> So, for our function of Y' = f(t, Y). I need to define f here, which takes position, velocity and time, and changes those based on engine & gravity acceleration, correct?
<egg|zzz|egg> yes
* egg|zzz|egg needs to get back to principia bugs, so might be slow to respond
<BPlayer> The function output is velocity and acceleration, then
<BPlayer> No problem, it's not like I am in a hurry
<egg|zzz|egg> yup, it's velocity and acceleration
<egg|zzz|egg> and the velocity is easy, you just take the one that was given to you as argument
<BPlayer> And if I run this thing in a Runge-Kutta integrator it all checks out itself and I get the position and stuff?
<egg|zzz|egg> (it's just that trick to turn a 2nd order differential equation to a first order one with higher dimension)
<egg|zzz|egg> that's the idea, yes
<egg|zzz|egg> BPlayer: you might find things easier to deal with if you start with a simple differential equation to test things out
<BPlayer> Well, for now I still needto figure out the maths of the Runge-Kutta integrator
<egg|zzz|egg> somethnig like y"=-y (harmonic oscillator)
<BPlayer> For I still don't understand how I am supposed to differentiate a single point...
<BPlayer> Also, I need to create a function out of the acceleration stuff. Which requires some not-immidiately-obvious maths too
<BPlayer> But I believe I can do that.
<BPlayer> What I need help with is the Runge-Kutta maths, again.
<BPlayer> One more thing too
<BPlayer> f takes as input t, position and velocity, but I only get an output of velocity and acceleration
<BPlayer> So how do I get the new position for each t? DO I just add the velocity to the previous position?
<egg|zzz|egg> f isn't the thing that gives you the new position, it's the thing that you use in the Runge-Kutta method to get the new position (and the new velocity)
<BPlayer> So I don't need to worry about it at all?
<egg|zzz|egg> <BPlayer> So how do I get the new position for each t? DO I just add the velocity to the previous position? <<< das ist vorwaerts Euler!
<egg|zzz|egg> BPlayer: you need to understand how a RK method works
<BPlayer> I believe I do
<egg|zzz|egg> then you need to write one, and test it on a very simple problem (not gravity, that's already more elaborate)
<egg|zzz|egg> try the differential equation q"=-q
<BPlayer> It's an Euler method, which takes the derivative of the midpoint and not the starting point, then it uses that derivative, takes the midpoint again, and so on
<egg|zzz|egg> in 1d
<egg|zzz|egg> no, it's more general than that
<egg|zzz|egg> but yes, that's the very rough idea
<egg|zzz|egg> doesn't have to be midpoints though
<BPlayer> But what else points can I use?
<egg|zzz|egg> BPlayer: I showed you this earlier, it's RK4 http://www.marekfiser.com/Img/600/480/Img/Projects/VectorFieldVis/RK4.141111.png
<BPlayer> Oh, yeah. I didn't understand that mess of arrows and lines then, but thought I understood the concept anyway. Let me take another look.
<egg|zzz|egg> BPlayer: they're not all halves, you have thirds and sixths
<egg|zzz|egg> you can have any sort of weird coefficients
<BPlayer> Well, let me stick to halves
<egg|zzz|egg> BPlayer: see also https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Runge%E2%80%93Kutta_methods#Explicit_Runge.E2.80.93Kutta_methods for another description of the method
<BPlayer> That seems easier
<egg|zzz|egg> no but you can't stick to half and implement an arbitray method
<egg|zzz|egg> just read the article
<BPlayer> I was looking at the German version of that
<egg|zzz|egg> anyawy, I need to get back to principia; afk
<BPlayer> Ah, wait, so that table is fixed for any Runge-Kutta grade?
<BPlayer> Okay, see you
<egg|zzz|egg> BPlayer: you can try poking other people with questions too, that can work (though UmbralRaptor is probably still asleep)
<egg|zzz|egg> BPlayer: yes, the table is fixed for any method
<egg|zzz|egg> (it's called a tableau even in english for reasons that are not very clear)
<egg|zzz|egg> BPlayer: the table defines the method in fact
<egg|zzz|egg> BPlayer: and the k_i (stages) are things that you compute for every step
* egg|zzz|egg back to debugging
<BPlayer> Humm, thanks
<BPlayer> Okay, poking anyone here: https://wikimedia.org/api/rest_v1/media/math/render/svg/44d56b38e104bfdf185d1307337e5c6e074b16c9 At line k_3 = ... it uses h as a function. I believe h is the time step, though? How does that work?
<BPlayer> Or is that a multiplication?
<egg|zzz|egg> yes, h is a common notation for the time step
<egg|zzz|egg> it's either called h or Δt
<egg|zzz|egg> h is probably more frequent
<BPlayer> So it is just a multiplication?
<egg|zzz|egg> yup
<BPlayer> Okay, thanks a lot!
<egg|zzz|egg> (yeah, you have to know what the Kreidehaufen is to know whether writing it next to something means multiplying or something fancier)
<egg|zzz|egg> notation is fun
<BPlayer> And, still, how does one calculate this butcher tableau? I haven't found anything on that...
<egg|zzz|egg> you look it up
<BPlayer> That's not something you just go and calculate, then? :D
<egg|zzz|egg> or you publish a paper in a journal of numerics where you come up with a new and fancier Butcher tableau
<egg|zzz|egg> but that's kind of the job of numericists :D
<BPlayer> Okay, got it
<egg|zzz|egg> (the tableau for RK4 for instance was invented by Runge and Kutta)
<BPlayer> Thanks a lot! I am downloading principia for KSP 1.3, you bought me here! :D
<egg|zzz|egg> we do not support 1.3 at this time
<egg|zzz|egg> only 1.2.2
<BPlayer> But when it's out
<egg|zzz|egg> we're not really in a hurry to support 1.3 tbh
<BPlayer> I still have 1.3, for my most essential mods haven't updated yet. I can wait.
<egg|zzz|egg> Cauchy will target 1.2.2 still
<BPlayer> I still have 1.2*
<BPlayer> This will be a hell of a lot of CPU time per iteration, I anticipate. And I want to do it in JS. Probably will look like xkcd.com/303/ except for it will say "calculating"
<egg|zzz|egg> why in JS?
<BPlayer> Because that's the only suitable language I know enough to implement that
<BPlayer> s/suitable/most suitable/
<Qboid> BPlayer meant to say: Because that's the only most suitable language I know enough to implement that
<BPlayer> egg: Now that I think of it, I am running into another problem
<BPlayer> This is planned to interplanetary ejection/injection burns... But the problem is, a spiraling burn will screw with the target ejection velocity as calculated with a launch window planner
<BPlayer> Is that even a problem I could theoretically solve some way?
<BPlayer> Or just add another correction burn somewhere?
<Iskierka> difference between the position of exit makes a negligible overall difference on the transfer. you're calculating a spiralling burn that will provide correct ejection velocity, then spin it around to find the starting position that gives correct direction
<BPlayer> That's the problem. I am not sure the ejection velocity is correct
<egg|zzz|egg> (in the two-body case which is what you're looking at)
<egg|zzz|egg> in the many-body case it's Fun
<BPlayer> I use https://alexmoon.github.io/ksp/ to calculate ejection/injection dV and plug that dV number into my "tool". That does not guarantee at all that the ejection velocity will still be correct.
<BPlayer> Need to go for some time... Be back (hopefully) soon.
<BPlayer> Thanks a lot for the help again.
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<egg|zzz|egg> !wpn Iskierka
* Qboid gives Iskierka an allotropic solenoid
<egg|zzz|egg> !wpn UmbralRaptor
* Qboid gives UmbralRaptor a threaded turnstile
<egg|zzz|egg> !wpn e_14159
* Qboid gives e_14159 a neodymium chromium DIAC with a flail attachment
<e_14159> I was summoned?
<soundnfury> !wpn egg|zzz|egg
* Qboid gives egg|zzz|egg a fried glider
<egg|zzz|egg> e_14159: no, I just gave you a wpn
* e_14159 flails wildly
<egg|zzz|egg> !wpn e_14159
* Qboid gives e_14159 an apochromatic 2N3906
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<BPlayer> Back!
<BPlayer> Okay, and now I need vector maths help...
<BPlayer> Somehow my school only taught vector addition and multiplication by scalar values, so I am a bit lost on that stuff.
<egg|zzz|egg> BPlayer: have you read the Feynman lectures bit referenced at the beginning of that pdf? that should cover some things
<BPlayer> No, I did not, let me see. Can I find them on the internet?
<egg|zzz|egg> yes
<BPlayer> Yep, found it. Thanks!
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<egg|zzz|egg> Iskierka: uh
<Iskierka> I want to know what planet she comes from
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<egg|zzz|egg> !wpn UmbralRaptor
* Qboid gives UmbralRaptor a nitrated kmath with an atlatl attachment
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<egg|zzz|egg> UmbralRaptor: live dinosaur https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jLOQjuy2Dyg
<kmath_> YouTube - Bella Hummingbird Live Stream
<egg|zzz|egg> !wpn UmbralRaptor
* Qboid gives UmbralRaptor a deterministic mathematician
<UmbralRaptor> Dinosaurs!
<UmbralRaptor> Qboid: so not pascal, kolmogorov, etc?
<egg|zzz|egg> UmbralRaptor: crows are quite noisy in the evening here lately, I wonder if there are some galaxy papers in the works
<UmbralRaptor> Are they mad about something?
<egg|zzz|egg> UmbralRaptor: why?
<UmbralRaptor> er, misread crows as cows.
<egg|zzz|egg> UmbralRaptor: ... so when a Kerbal is on a ladder, the ladder is charged with imbuing the Kerbal with weight
<egg|zzz|egg> KSP is nuts
<UmbralRaptor> This is about to become s/egg|zzz|egg/egg|aaa|egg/
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<BPlayer> Hi again!
<UmbralRaptor> \o
<UmbralRaptor> egg|zzz|egg: IIRC, that was how "kraken drives" worked.
<egg|zzz|egg> UmbralRaptor: ah but in stock that shouldn't be an issue, because the planet ignores the Kerbal
<egg|zzz|egg> you see in Kerbal physics, when you touch a ladder, gravity doesn't directly apply to you anymore
<egg|zzz|egg> instead the ladder imbues you with weight
<egg|zzz|egg> UmbralRaptor: the net effect should be the same
<egg|zzz|egg> UmbralRaptor: I see that there are still some kraken drives based on ladders though; I guess the logic is ripe for weird edge cases https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-THq8Gip-Us
<kmath_> YouTube - To the Mun and back without engines or fuel (working Kraken drive)
<Iskierka> if they did it entirely with actual forces, it'd be easy enough to balance it. but it's hard to hold a thing in place with calculated & predicted forces
<Iskierka> so they use a lot of fuzzy impulses and holding that don't have predictable force
<egg|zzz|egg> anyway, TIL that when I touch a ladder gravity proceeds from the ladder
<egg|zzz|egg> this is isn't even bad API design; it's nuts beyond my ability to word it
<egg|zzz|egg> the ladder imbues you with gravity
<egg|zzz|egg> whyyyyy
<Iskierka> gravity lifts
<BPlayer> egg, if I am not a total annoyance to you yet...
<BPlayer> For what I am doing, I probably need to get an input as a circular, equatorial orbit and I will have to convert that to a velocity and position vector, right?
<UmbralRaptor> Incidentally, are pods still the same mass whether or not they contain kerbals?
<egg|zzz|egg> UmbralRaptor: no idea
<BPlayer> UmbralRaptor: They are
<BPlayer> Command seats are not, AFAIK
<UmbralRaptor> BPlayer: Hah!
<egg|zzz|egg> BPlayer: I don't know what input you get, that's something you know :-p but you're going to need to turn that to cartesian coordinates, yes
<Iskierka> ... so by a kerbal getting out and sitting outside for a bit you alter the orbit
<UmbralRaptor> BPlayer: that sounds about right. I think Fundamentals of Astrodynamics has the conversions?
<egg|zzz|egg> Iskierka: only in current principia
<Iskierka> then again when it gets out and climbs inside
<egg|zzz|egg> Iskierka: oh
<egg|zzz|egg> Iskierka: you mean because of the mass?
<egg|zzz|egg> Iskierka: or because of the weight
<Iskierka> ... I don't know I'm confused now
<Iskierka> certainly if it was spinning it'll change as you climb into the seat
<egg|zzz|egg> there are separate things: EVAing creates weight, and touching a ladder means weight is imbued into you by the ladder
<egg|zzz|egg> s/s weight/s mass/
<Qboid> egg|zzz|egg meant to say: there are separate things: EVAing creates mass, and touching a ladder means weight is imbued into you by the ladder
<egg|zzz|egg> BPlayer: yeah, that'll do
<egg|zzz|egg> BPlayer: or that C++ I linked you will also do
<egg|zzz|egg> !wpn UmbralRaptor
* Qboid gives UmbralRaptor a fractal pentagon
* UmbralRaptor penrose-tiles egg|zzz|egg
<egg|zzz|egg> UmbralRaptor: that bug was just nuts though
<BPlayer> But what I mean, if I have a circular orbit, I can shortcut that keplerian -> cartesian conversion somehow, for example by using vis viva. Can I not?
<egg|zzz|egg> why is the ladder in charge of imbuing you with weight
<UmbralRaptor> Yeah, a circular equitorial orbit is barely 2D, so you can do a very simplified conversion.
<egg|zzz|egg> BPlayer: ask the astronomer dinosaur in the room
<UmbralRaptor> But I'm less clear on why vis-viva. Uh, can I have the full problem restated?
<BPlayer> Well, I am trying to create a tool to help plan extremely low TWR interplanetary hohmann transfer burns
* UmbralRaptor needs an avatar of a dinosaur (avian okay, dromeosaur preferred) working with a telescope. >_>
<BPlayer> Umbral: I'll do one if I can
<BPlayer> Give me a day or two
<BPlayer> Anyway, back to the problem. E.gg suggested I use an ordinary differential equation and plug that into a Runge-Kutta Integrator, in the form of q''(t) = acc_gravity(q(t)) + acc_engines(q(t),t)
<BPlayer> So now here we are. I need to implement that in JavaScript and I am checking some details
<UmbralRaptor> egg|zzz|egg: Hah.
* UmbralRaptor isn't familair with JS, but this seems reasonableish.
<egg|zzz|egg> UmbralRaptor: it's on APOD even https://apod.nasa.gov/apod/ap030401.html
<BPlayer> Umbral: Do you want a cartoon-ish image or a photo-realistic one?
egg|zzz|egg is now known as egg|nomz|egg
* UmbralRaptor wasn't 100% serious, but either/or. Probably more cartoonish, since it would likely be shown at low resolution.
<BPlayer> The plan is to find an image of a telescope and photoshop that into one of a dromeosaur. Not too hard, just need to find appropriate images
<BPlayer> UmbralRaptor: Is that a dromeosaur? No idea, just got that from a Google query: https://cdn6.bigcommerce.com/s-fme25/product_images/uploaded_images/dromaeosaur.jpg?t=1431395279
<UmbralRaptor> Oh, hey. One of the old featherless reconstructions.
<Iskierka> [featherless screeching]
<UmbralRaptor> Er, yeah. That's a deinonychus.
<BPlayer> The second one looks like it's just as stable as my last Mun lander
<BPlayer> That is, it will tip if you sneeze at it... Even on the Mun.
<BPlayer> So the first image is suitable?
<BPlayer> I mean, the first one of yours
<UmbralRaptor> yeah
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<BPlayer> Could you link the wikipedia page where that's from?
<BPlayer> I'd like to find the corresponding wikimedia commons page to see the license
<UmbralRaptor> (Also features additional reconstructions!)
<Iskierka> reverse image search thinks that's "chicken with dinosaur legs"
<UmbralRaptor> Er, wait. my first one would be from the Deinonychus page.
<Iskierka> (pretty sure all chickens have dinosaur legs)
<UmbralRaptor> Anyway, link to your code? (To see if I understand the math)
<BPlayer> To mine?
<UmbralRaptor> Yeah.
<BPlayer> Umbral: The image is licensed CC BY SA
<BPlayer> I.e. I may do what I want, but I have to attach the same license to it and put a short credit notice
<BPlayer> As for my code, there is no link, and basically no code (yet). Well, at least not the code that does the math magic
<UmbralRaptor> Ah
<BPlayer> I shall really get myself a GitHub account
<BPlayer> But the math is fairly beefy, IMO. I doubt you would understand it without further explanation, unless you already know what it does
<BPlayer> Test
<Iskierka> you'd be surprised what mathematicians just glance at and go "okay"
<UmbralRaptor> BPlayer: no unit tests yet.
* UmbralRaptor is not a mathematician, but there is the off chance that I'd find something.
<BPlayer> I'll work on it in the next few days, and post my progress. Or I'll make myself a GitHub account and do it there. I mean, I'll really need one some day, why not benefit from it now?
<BPlayer> Ugh, now I can't find a telescope image
* UmbralRaptor lessthanthrees GitHub.
<BPlayer> Didn't think there were so few
<BPlayer> I mean, there are plenty, but license stuffs... Ugh
<BPlayer> Do you think it is bad if I just use an image from Amazon for it?
<Iskierka> image taken from a telescope or of?
<UmbralRaptor> If it's of a celestron/meade/orion/obsession/whatever, it's probably not particularly bad.
<BPlayer> Of, not from
<BPlayer> Umbral: How do you mean that?
<UmbralRaptor> ie: if it's a stock photo of a major telescope brand, it's the sort of thing where I expect a lack of harm. (Photographer was paid, etc)
<BPlayer> Iskierka: Doesn not quite fit my needs
<BPlayer> Uh, ignore that extra n
<BPlayer> UmbralRaptor, okay let me choose a picture and you say if it's okay then.
<Iskierka> lots of others on wiki and you're guaranteed they have good licensing, pretty much
<BPlayer> Iskierka: I've looked on Wiki, didn't find any, TBH
<egg|nomz|egg> <Iskierka> you'd be surprised what mathematicians just glance at and go "okay" <<< context? :D
<egg|nomz|egg> oh hey a vixen refractor
<BPlayer> CC BY SA too
<BPlayer> egg: Soon to be operated by a raptor
<BPlayer> :P
<egg|nomz|egg> ferram4: read principia#1415
<Qboid> [#1415] title: Vessel relative velocities change when switching to EVA | Park 2 vessels close to each other with as less relative speed as possible. Perform EVA from anyone of the vessels. The other vessel starts moving away with relative speed of about 2-3 m/s (as reported by the target frame navball.) Attaching a save file where this can be immediately verified.... | https://github.com/moc
<Qboid> kingbirdnest/principia/issues/1415
<egg|nomz|egg> ferram4: it is nuts
<BPlayer> Oh well. Need to go again. See you tomorrow!
<UmbralRaptor> \o
<BPlayer> Anyway, bye.
<ferram4> egg|nomz|egg, KSP
<egg|nomz|egg> ferram4: yes but still
<egg|nomz|egg> even for ksp
<ferram4> Magic forces.
<egg|nomz|egg> ferram4: yeah but what decision process leads to that madness
egg|nomz|egg is now known as egg
<egg> ferram4: they have code to apply gravity
<UmbralRaptor> Kerbals naturally have reactionless thrusters. EVA packs just provide a power source to use them more effectively.
<egg> they disable it on the kerbal that's on a ladder, and the ladder imbues them with weight instead
<egg> whyyyyyyyyyy
<SnoopJeDi> egg, re: botching Principia as Prinicipia, my command of English in written form has been declining alarmingly recently o.o
<egg> SnoopJeDi: that's Latin though :p-
BPlayer has quit [Ping timeout: 180 seconds]
<egg> s/p-/-p
<Qboid> egg meant to say: SnoopJeDi: that's Latin though :-p
<SnoopJeDi> Fair point
<UmbralRaptor> All words are English words. Some just don't know it yet.
<Iskierka> ... I'm now disappointed we don't have a twitter bot
<SnoopJeDi> there was https://twitter.com/lizzietheircbot once upon a 2015-2016
Spectr0 has joined #kspacademia
* egg pokes greening in the lizzie
* egg pokes norgg in the bots
NIBIRU has joined #kspacademia
<NIBIRU> hi
<NIBIRU> hello???
<NIBIRU> hello????
<UmbralRaptor> ...
<UmbralRaptor> THe "I" in IRC stands for idle.
<UmbralRaptor> Sometimes channels will go 10s of seconds, or even minutes without activity.
<SnoopJeDi> Inconceivable!
<NIBIRU> i use tool:move and first the all go up or down but i hit a key i think and now 1 go up and 1 go down
<egg> uh
<egg> I feel like I'm missing some context here
<egg> !wpn UmbralRaptor
* Qboid gives UmbralRaptor a Helmholtz 2N7000
<NIBIRU> i have 2 parts
<NIBIRU> on the wing
<NIBIRU> when i use tool:move the 2 part go up or down
<NIBIRU> and now 1 go up and 1 go down
<NIBIRU> how do i change that back?
<SnoopJeDi> I think you're looking for #kspofficial, NIBIRU, this channel is only occasionally about the game itself >_>
* UmbralRaptor guesses a part got flipped somehow.
<NIBIRU> SnoopJeDi no i look for some one to help
<egg> UmbralRaptor: or radial symmetry being used instead of mirror?
<NIBIRU> is there no help channel?
<UmbralRaptor> There's #KSPOfficial
<UmbralRaptor> egg: or that
<egg> NIBIRU: this is mostly about academic silliness
<UmbralRaptor> But, it's sort of hard to test at the moment, seeing as the only computer I have full control over can't run KSP.
<egg> NIBIRU: the most KSPish thing here is me blathering about principia development
<egg> which sometimes is about KSP and sometimes is about astrophysics
<egg> or numerics
<egg> lots of numerics
<NIBIRU> UmbralRaptor no one is there, every one is idlers
<egg> also there are catpics
<UmbralRaptor> NIBIRU: you did get a response
<NIBIRU> UmbralRaptor from just one
<NIBIRU> bad one
<NIBIRU> he did say R key
<NIBIRU> nothing happen
<Spectr0> nibiru the planet of the anunaki :s
<NIBIRU> help us
* UmbralRaptor throws gold at NIBIRU?
<NIBIRU> did restart but nothing did change
<egg> Iskierka: dinosaur!
<UmbralRaptor> Birb!
<UmbralRaptor> Not sure if rude or helpful.
<Iskierka> turtle on shelf is now turtle in bucket
<SnoopJeDi> you can't explain that
<egg> UmbralRaptor: should I play some df
<UmbralRaptor> egg: sure
<egg> !seen Norgg
<Qboid> egg: I haven't seen the user Norgg yet.
* egg gives UmbralRaptor a ladder.
<egg> icefire: clearly I'll take the avocado toasts, that house is awfully ugly
<egg> nice blog on architecture ^
<SnoopJeDi> hey, Harford County! I'm from there!
<UmbralRaptor> Eating out at semi-nice sit down places ($15-20) would run ~450-620/mo. I'm struck by the fact that a 2bd 1 bath I was at in Overland Park for a while was notably cheap at $700/mo. Plus utilities.
<egg> ow, I have a couple of wounded dwarves after the mopping up from this invasion
<egg> foot wounds
<egg> UmbralRaptor: but they are being looked at by the doctors of starwatch of oxen
* egg is not sure if that's entirely reassuring
<SnoopJeDi> HAH, the DuClaw chalk label
<UmbralRaptor> egg: Their insurance refuses coverage. Also something about "out of network"
<UmbralRaptor> (Also, doctors or doctors?)
<egg> UmbralRaptor: I have competent surgeons but they're busy chatting in the library, so a dabbling surgeon did the job
<egg> UmbralRaptor: seems to have worked?
<Iskierka> #nocontext
<egg> Iskierka: DF
<Iskierka> It's more fun without context
<UmbralRaptor> DF is usually distinctive enough that you can divine that much context.
<egg> UmbralRaptor: basically all those who opened a book about surgery think they can do it, I should probably forbid them from touching a patient
<Iskierka> are they managing at least?
<egg> ah now an expert human diagnoser will look at a dwarf
<egg> UmbralRaptor: that human recently felt doubt after discussing pulmonary medicine
<egg> also doubt
<egg> s/doubt/tidal height/
<Qboid> egg meant to say: also tidal height
<egg> and combustible materials
<egg> UmbralRaptor: ... basically nomal but with doubt
<egg> "he was in doubt after discussing aqua regia"
<egg> "he was in doubt after discussing plants as surgical models"
<egg> "he was in doubt after discussing fracture classifications"
<egg> uh, you're going to be looking at a fracture
<UmbralRaptor> Perhaps the data had a large p-value?
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<egg> UmbralRaptor: Nomal is socializing!
<UmbralRaptor> Is it making her anxious?
<egg> UmbralRaptor: she was interested after watching a performance!