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<Mat2ch>
I hate people.
<Mat2ch>
"I had never a problem with it" yeah, and that makes you what?
<Althego>
wrong channel?
<SporkWitch>
works for me! :P
<Althego>
how many test engineers do you need to replace a light bulb? none, "the light bulb works perfectly in my test setup"
<SporkWitch>
hehe
<Mat2ch>
Nah. I made a forum post. First answer "never had a problem with this"
<Mat2ch>
Stupid stupid people.
<Mat2ch>
I hate them.
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<Althego>
hehe, why post that? it doesnt add anything
<SporkWitch>
If it was JUST that, yeah, but "i've never encountered that, but here's some speculation about what could potentially cause it" is something I've responded with before, or asking for additional information to better speculate. I find most initial questions are really vague
<FLHerne>
also, sometimes "never had that problem" is useful just because it shows it's not a broad unavoidable game bug
<FLHerne>
and something more specific to your system/craft/whatever
<FLHerne>
depends if the issue you're asking about is something obviously niche though
<Mat2ch>
just made a suggestion for KSP2 https://forum.kerbalspaceprogram.com/index.php?/topic/211116-consider-moving-the-building-parts-menu-to-a-popup-menu-at-the-center-of-the-screen-like-in-avorion/
<FLHerne>
tbh I agree with that guy
<FLHerne>
the current menu is out of the way
<FLHerne>
and you need to switch parts frequently so a centered one would be obscuring my view of the craft all the time
<SporkWitch>
Gonna have to agree as well, also, the overwhelming majority of people still use 16:9 aspect ratios; ultrawides are still fairly uncommon
<SporkWitch>
Also remember that KSP2 will be using largely procedural parts, so you're not going to be grabbing as many, you're mostly going to be interacting with those sliders, that ARE closer to the work area you're interacting with.
<Mat2ch>
FLHerne: In Avorion you enable/disable the menu all the time.
<Mat2ch>
People don't seem to get this.
<Althego>
both seem to eb a workable conept
<FLHerne>
I've never played Avorion, and probably most people haven't, so why is that surprising?
<Althego>
i mean why have the parts menu on screen when you are moving a part
<FLHerne>
I know I hate modal dialogs that block my view of what I'm doing
<Mat2ch>
Because I've written what it does and people don't seem to be read my words and at least are trying to understand them?
<FLHerne>
at least when there's usually plenty of screen space at the sides
<FLHerne>
I mean, the concept of how it's supposed to work seems pretty clear
<Althego>
you know the basic assumptions of gui design: the user cant read, the user cant click
<FLHerne>
but I don't like it
<Althego>
seems to be the same for forums :)
<Mat2ch>
Althego: I hate people!
<FLHerne>
which is personal preference
<Althego>
in both cases however maybe some keyboard shortcuts would be useful for faster addign of parts
<Mat2ch>
FLHerne: In Avorion you press space, the building blocks menu shows up, you select the part you want and release space
<Mat2ch>
and now you can place the part
<FLHerne>
for unusually large/wide monitors I can see the advantage, but I don't have one
<SporkWitch>
few people do
<Mat2ch>
the menu is right in the middle, where your mouse cursors sits
<Mat2ch>
I have a 27" screen, which is wide enough to make this annoying.
<Althego>
i have a 30" screen :)
<SporkWitch>
I'm running 32" screens, never been an issue
<Mat2ch>
Bragger! :D
<Althego>
and i find it annoying that the parts couldnt be grouped in a way that no scrolling is needed in any of the groups
<Mat2ch>
2k? 4?
<Althego>
i think 1 or 2 needs scrolling, quite annoying
<Althego>
2560x1600
<Mat2ch>
That's 2k with some addition on top. :P
<Althego>
this monitor is getting old, i plan to replace it with a 4k
<SporkWitch>
2560x1440, display is a metre from my face?
<Althego>
never occured to me to bring phones home
<Mat2ch>
the scaling makes it usable.
<Mat2ch>
But on a 4k screen, not scaled the building menu will be very small and very far away.
<Althego>
most of the issues are not related to physical hardware, we use soft clietns
<Mat2ch>
Adding different voip phone manufactures into the mix of a voip phone exchange makes things, ehm, interesting...
<SporkWitch>
exactly, which is necessary with any UI at these resolutions, screen sizes, and viewing distances. Actually annoys me on PS4 sometimes, as some games did NOT scale the UI well on my 4k (60-something inches i think?) TV and making it difficult to read
<SporkWitch>
Majority are still runnin 1920x1080
<Mat2ch>
They will update in the life-time of KSP2...
<SporkWitch>
Sure? And that's why UI scale is a setting in most games that didn't start on consoles (it's actually something that the Restoration team has been struggling with for a while, because SWG didn't have a UI scale setting, and at modern resolutions it's barely readable)
<Mat2ch>
KSP is almost 10 years old.
<SporkWitch>
likely more work to make it a modal window you can drag around and/or minimize, plus having to worry about people accidentally hiding it off-screen and having to reset to defaults. They also want to maintain some interface consistency with KSP1, while improving on that base. The only really drastic change is moving the in-flight staging to the right side, and once again that's about consistency
<SporkWitch>
since that's where it is in the VAB and SPH
<Mat2ch>
No idea how the world will look in 10 years, but displays are moving to 4k right now
<SporkWitch>
for TVs; on computers 2k is still the most common even for high-end gaming-marketed displays.
<SporkWitch>
In no small part because there's almost no combination of hardware and a game with sufficient optimization to actually maintain high performance at 4k, and typically people in that high-end niche are more worried about refresh rates and frame rates, hence most of the high-end ones being stupid-high refresh rates at 2k
<SporkWitch>
Though again, even at those higher resolutions, that's what the UI scale slider is for
<SporkWitch>
(I'd end up doing that anyway, because even if the menu was in the middle, at default UI scales things would be too tiny to be really usable)
<umaxtu>
I want a nice ultrawide. but they charge a premium for them
<SporkWitch>
I just don't see what I'd use one for. It's never horizontal space I'm lacking, it's vertical. I've considered picking up one of those dynamically rotating monitors before, the ones you can flip to portrait and the display resolution and orientation adjusts accordingily. Really nice for long documents
<SporkWitch>
What games I have that would benefit from more horizontal display are either multi-window apps already, or have native support for multiple displays.
<umaxtu>
wpuld clean up my cabling quite a bit and no bezels
<SporkWitch>
fair, though you can get some REALLY small bezels these days, and a few have even made prisms that mount to the joins and make the bezels disappear
<SporkWitch>
I might actually do this at some point, though I'll need to kidnap a friend to help me fix the mounting of my displays so they're lined up better. Just too heavy for me to get it perfect solo
* umaxtu
takes a screenshot for evidence
<SporkWitch>
lol
<SporkWitch>
foiled, looks like they don't make them for 32" displays :(
<SporkWitch>
umaxtu: What list am I on, Santa? "Well, I've been looking at the memes you've been posting... so probably DHS, NSA, and the FBI...?"
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<Mat2ch>
Ok, I will never make any suggestion anymore.
<Mat2ch>
People just don't think for at least a short moment.
<Mat2ch>
I should've known better
<SporkWitch>
Coming off more like projection here; the real issue appears to be that no one seems to agree that there's an issue or that your proposed solution would actually be an improvement.
<Mat2ch>
They don't agree, because they are used to the way it always was.
<Mat2ch>
Some arguments are just plain stupid, others don't include the problem at all.
<Mat2ch>
It's more like a "we've done it always that way" reaction, than a real discussion
<Mat2ch>
I wonder when I will get comments from the mods for my answers...
<FLHerne>
UI discussions don't have a lot of scope for productive discussion often
<FLHerne>
it's mostly personal preference, unless you have some very specific example of why some aspect is a problem
<FLHerne>
reading it, everyone seems to understand what you mean, just don't like it for KSP
<FLHerne>
I don't care if it's easy to toggle, it's frequent distracting context-switching to so
<FLHerne>
*to avoid a
<FLHerne>
bleh mobile keyboard
<FLHerne>
*to avoid a problem that most users don't seem to find significant
<FLHerne>
maybe TheAziz didn't
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