raptop changed the topic of #principia to: READ THE FAQ: http://goo.gl/gMZF9H; The current version is Galileo. We currently target 1.5.1, 1.6.1, 1.7.x, 1.8.1, and 1.9.1. <scott_manley> anyone that doubts the wisdom of retrograde bop needs to get the hell out | https://xkcd.com/323/ | <egg> calculating the influence of lamont on Pluto is a bit silly… | <egg> also 4e16 m * 2^-52 is uncomfortably large
<UmbralRaptop>
egg🥚卵
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<discord->
lpg. — huh. my 2nd moon orbiter is still around after nearly 1000 days. accidental frozen orbit?
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<discord->
Skylar. — Huh nice
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<discord->
Zeusbeer. — if you have orbit analysis window open = silent eg
<discord->
Zeusbeer. — if you have orbit analysis window open = silent egg (edited)
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<discord->
Emperor Taisho. — > huh. my 2nd moon orbiter is still around after nearly 1000 days. accidental frozen orbit?
<discord->
Emperor Taisho. — @lpg theres a frozen orbit at 50 degrees inclination
<discord->
Emperor Taisho. — youre somewhat close to that
<discord->
Emperor Taisho. — also youre not really in LLO
<discord->
Emperor Taisho. — below 100km
<discord->
neamisis. — I have a question about principia
<discord->
neamisis. — I'm new to principia and RO/RSS
<discord->
neamisis. — why does my orbit seem to change inclination? or is it looking like that because I've set the "future orbit" as like several days?
<discord->
Standecco. — Earth isn't a perfect sphere, so the uneven pull it has on your orbit makes it precess and change inclination
<discord->
neamisis. — so due to the uneven gravitationa; acceleration on my craft it's changing?
<discord->
neamisis. — That's awesome! principia is so detailed
<discord->
Zeusbeer. — also the moon has an impact depending on how high the orbit is
<discord->
Zeusbeer. — you will notice that a bit on geostationary sats
<discord->
neamisis. — it's leo about 177 km perigee and 179 apogee
<discord->
neamisis. — oh awesome!
<discord->
Zeusbeer. — also send a screenshot
<discord->
Standecco. — Earth isn't a perfect sphere, so the uneven pull it has on your craft makes its orbit precess and change inclination (edited)
<discord->
Zeusbeer. — maybe your in the surface reference frame, making it compare it to the surface
<discord->
Zeusbeer. — that could make it appear that the inclination is changing drastically
<discord->
neamisis. — oh
<discord->
neamisis. — well i'll ask later then
<discord->
neamisis. — as im currently not playing ksp
<discord->
Zeusbeer. — alright
<discord->
neamisis. — also
<discord->
neamisis. — I have a mission in mind
<discord->
neamisis. — like
<discord->
neamisis. — using kOS in RSS/RO and principia to recreate the curiosity mission
<discord->
neamisis. — do i need to learn orbital mechanics?
<discord->
Standecco. — that's not very specific, depends what you mean
<discord->
Standecco. — how in depth do you want to get?
<discord->
neamisis. — what do you mean?
<discord->
neamisis. — i wanna recreate the mission using kOS everything is automated
<discord->
Standecco. — so you want to press go and wait until your rover has landed on mars?
<discord->
neamisis. — yea like that
<discord->
Standecco. — you'll need to learn kOS more than anything
<discord->
neamisis. — yea I'm learning that now
<discord->
Standecco. — principia adds n-body, but it's not very relevant for a mars transfer; your orbits are going to be mostly keplerian, since curiosity's transfer was a simple hohmann transfer, iirc
<discord->
Standecco. — principia adds n-body (and other things), but it's not very relevant for a mars transfer; your orbits are going to be mostly keplerian, since curiosity's transfer was a simple hohmann transfer, iirc (edited)
<discord->
neamisis. — so for a homann transfer it's gonna be similar to patched conics?
<discord->
Standecco. — mostly, yes; what's going to be different is planning the maneuver, but if you're going to use kOS, you may not have to go through that
<discord->
Standecco. — what's going to be _hard_ is planning the transfer burn with kOS
<discord->
Standecco. — for that you're going to have to learn a bit
<discord->
neamisis. — yea for that do i need orbital mechanics?
<discord->
Standecco. — I wouldn't know how to do that; you certainly need to learn some orbital mechanics, yes
<discord->
neamisis. — oh ok then
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<discord->
Standecco. — mostly math and computers though; it's fundamentally an optimization problem
<discord->
neamisis. — yea
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Zeusbeer. — planning a mars transfer with KOS in principia, that's an insane plan, good luck
<discord->
Standecco. — check out MJ's porkchop planner, it does what you're trying to achieve
<discord->
neamisis. — it gives a porkchp plot?
<discord->
Standecco. — yes, but a porkchop plot is just a fancy way to visualize the results of solving your problem
<discord->
Standecco. — I suppose (could be completely wrong) that you can get a linear system whose solution is a burnout velocity as a function of current time and travel time; then a porkchop plot is just a fancy way to visualize what combination gets you the lowest Δv between starting and final conditions
<discord->
neamisis. — so a system of equations in 2 variables (the current time and travel time)
<discord->
Standecco. — but it's hard, since I'm pretty sure this is a differential equation you're trying to solve and I'm not sure at all if it is an ordinary diff equation
<discord->
neamisis. — i think it's gonna be a ODE since I've never seen a PDE used in orbital mechanics but could be a ode idk
<discord->
Standecco. — actually, the variables that you have (which can be simplified if you assume the burn is instantaneous) are starting x,y,z coordinates, starting vx,vy,vz velocity, final x,y,z, coordinates, final vx,vy,vz velocity
<discord->
Standecco. — actually, the variables that you have (which can be simplified if you assume the burn is instantaneous) are starting x,y,z coordinates, starting vx,vy,vz velocity, final x,y,z coordinates, final vx,vy,vz velocity (edited)
<discord->
neamisis. — oh well
<discord->
neamisis. — time to spend an hour a week learning orbital mechanics
<discord->
Standecco. — I suppose you can reduce your starting position and velocity to a function of time, since you're in orbit
<discord->
Standecco. — now I suppose I should go and find out how wrong I was
<discord->
neamisis. — lol
<discord->
neamisis. — also
<discord->
neamisis. — the people on reddit seemed to worship a guide
<discord->
neamisis. — the RSS/RO installation guide
<discord->
neamisis. — on github
<discord->
neamisis. — is it really that necessary to follow it
<discord->
Standecco. — we all do, it's our creed
<discord->
Standecco. — why wouldn't you want to follow it?
<discord->
neamisis. — it's not that i don't wanna follow it
<discord->
neamisis. — i just installed all the dependencies of all the mods and it seems to be working fine
<discord->
neamisis. — manually
<discord->
Standecco. — well, that's what the guide does; gets into what is a dependency and why
<discord->
Standecco. — if you have experience with modding, it's not really needed
<discord->
Standecco. — the average ksp user is usually less experienced and often screws up the installation
<discord->
neamisis. — are there other mods that can be used with the rp-1?
<discord->
Standecco. — RP-1 is mostly for career; I assume you want to do your curiosity thing in sandbox?
<discord->
neamisis. — i wanna do both lol
<discord->
neamisis. — the last tech tree nodes (2100-2150+) seemed empty
<discord->
neamisis. — in rp1
<discord->
Standecco. — they are, but even if they weren't you couldn't practically use those with principia, for various reasons
<discord->
neamisis. — oh why? do they use like FTl
<discord->
neamisis. — ftL
<discord->
Standecco. — RP1 doesn't have anything in those nodes, but it's not like there's much out there other than KSPIE (for the moment)
<discord->
neamisis. — interstellar extended can be used for rp-1?
<discord->
Standecco. — > oh why? do they use like FTl
<discord->
Standecco. — @neamisis no FTL (we like physics here), but the reasons are mostly 1. Getting to other stars takes a long time and principia isn't really made for these kind of timescales
<discord->
Standecco. — 2. It will take a loooong time to get there in a RP1 career (reasonably an year or more irl)
<discord->
Standecco. — 3. Principia has issues (#2400) with old saves; trajectories take up a lot of space (you can get into hundreds of MB territory for a single savefile), which makes loading times absurdly long
<discord->
Standecco. — > interstellar extended can be used for rp-1?
<discord->
Standecco. — @neamisis no, it's not supported even by RO
<discord->
neamisis. — oh wow
<discord->
neamisis. — lol we like physics here
<discord->
neamisis. — but a wormhole is one of the solutions to the einstien field equatiosn so... wormholes a physics lol