<regex>
Yeah, that's quite a read, lol. <- intro paragraph was accurate
<egg>
:D
<egg>
!u ?
<Qboid>
U+1F311 NEW MOON SYMBOL (?)
<SnoopJeDi>
The clip art is pretty busy but the illustration of the importance of reference frame should probably help quite a bit
<e_14159>
But I don't want to be given to Iskierka.
<regex>
That's good, great doc.
<regex>
egg you guys do need a target vessel frame, though.
<egg>
yes, yes
<egg>
maybe in Cartan? I think it's doable
<egg>
regex: so I guess the reference frames you need are "vessel-centred inertial" and "vessel-centred *some celestial*-aligned
<regex>
tbh I was just echoing your statement at the end of the doc. :)
<egg>
I know, but we *do* need that frame :D
<regex>
Yeah, and relative velocity is crucial
<regex>
really looking forward to the nesxt one though, that's what I'm waiting on for a 1.2.2 install.
<egg>
well once you're close enough to be where relative velocity as a number matters, you can just use the stock facilities
<egg>
you're doing the approach
<egg>
the hard part is the rendez-vous
<egg>
and there you want plots and distance at closest approach etc.
<egg>
the easy thing for *some celestial* is to pick the main body
<egg>
but other things can be relevant too, e.g. the sun (so that you know whether you dock during daytime)
<egg>
hmm
<egg>
wait no, if you align to the sun, the planet will just rotate around you, but that won't help you know whether you're on the night side
<egg>
and if you're using earth-centred sun-aligned, then you're not vessel-centred anymore, and you don't see your approach
<egg>
bah, main body will have to do then
<regex>
Yeah
<regex>
that makes sense conceptually
<egg>
or maybe also display the closest approach markers stocklike
<regex>
(and probably also visiaully)
<regex>
That would work as well
<egg>
(when using a non-vessel-centred frame)
<egg>
so you can plan an approach in a vessel-centred frame, and see whether it lands you in daytime
<egg>
"The prediction, painted in fuchsia, shows where your vessel will go if you just sit on your hands" << I like phl's writing style :D
<SnoopJeDi>
Cute, but probably not doing any favors to ESL readers :(
<regex>
"ESL"?
<regex>
Ah, english second language
<SnoopJeDi>
English as a second language
* SnoopJeDi
picks at nits
<egg>
well, we are both ESL though, so we might have a sense of that (it's explained in the next sentence: "The prediction, painted in fuchsia, shows where your vessel will go if you just sit on your hands: no engine burns, no separations, no nothing.")
<regex>
Also, sitting on one's hands isn't really an idiom, it's very descriptive of a non-activity
<SnoopJeDi>
no skin off my back
<regex>
but what do I know, I only speak one language
<egg>
this is a fairly good example actually: I didn't know it was an idiom
<egg>
thought it sounded funny, but it's descriptive enough, and clarified in the next sentence in any case
<regex>
well, it's not, really, but i think it's a primarily English language-world saying
<egg>
yeah, it's a saying that people use, not something that phl made up
<egg>
but I don't think I heard it before
<egg>
(read, had the phrase magically piped into my brain, whatever)
<regex>
lol
<egg>
!wpn e_14159
* Qboid
gives e_14159 a bipartite goose
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<egg>
!wpn GreeningGalaxy
* Qboid
gives GreeningGalaxy a regular erbium polyhedron
<GreeningGalaxy>
whitequark: can a propane or butane torch be modified to burn MAPP gas? Or is the nozzle going to be the wrong shape/size to produce the necessary combustion ratio?
<GreeningGalaxy>
!wpn egg
* Qboid
gives egg a public arrow which vaguely resembles a mass-driver
<egg>
regex: something we want to do too, now that our code is very much aware of the parts (that's the other big part of Cardano besides tilt, pile-ups of parts), is to make the flight planner part-aware, so that it updates its mass from the parts, knows about the inactive engines, staging, whatever (so you can plan burns using boosters, and don't have to reset your flight plan upon staging, etc.). That won't be in Cartan I
<egg>
think, I would rather focus on vessel-centred trajectories (that's deeper in our code, in physics rather than ksp_plugin, and I need a break from the KSP side of thing after this release :D)
<regex>
yeah, that's like writing Engineer or Mechjeb all over again.
<regex>
Maybe use their iterator?
<regex>
are the licenses compatible?
<regex>
would save you some time, I don't know if you and your father are "not in my house" style developers...
<SnoopJeDi>
yeesh, KER is under GPL?
<egg>
regex: well we *have* made our own geometry libs >_>
<egg>
and yeah, MJ is GPL too
<SnoopJeDi>
hrm.
<egg>
so not touching it with a 10-light-nanosecond essential singularity
<regex>
I don't blame you. :P
<SnoopJeDi>
that said I would suspect mod authors would be pretty willing to sharealike and agree to use under the terms of some other license for Principia, but...
<SnoopJeDi>
I can't judge too harshly, I chose GPL for game modification once upon a time (and regret it)
<egg>
SnoopJeDi: regex: but tbh, it's not like we want to do MJ or KER in principia, we don't want to know *that much* about the vessel; we already do a bit, we could just integrate that with the parts we know etc.
<egg>
but probably not in Cartan
<SnoopJeDi>
Oh sure, that was never a doubt for me
<SnoopJeDi>
You do like to DIY :)
<egg>
SnoopJeDi: speaking of which at some point we'll want to improve the speed of trajectory plotting; to do that we need to decimate based on the rendered curvature
<SnoopJeDi>
For some reason that makes me think of d3.js
<egg>
SnoopJeDi: so we'll need camera projection code on the Principia side :D
<SnoopJeDi>
I guess because you said curvature and Mike Bostock has a soft spot for map projections
<SnoopJeDi>
and uh GIS in general I guess, he did invent TopoJSON
<regex>
egg, you said you want to handle staging, that sort of thing, you need a Engineer/MechJeb-sort of iterator for crawling the craft tree.
<regex>
Whether you do that yourself or borrow one is no business of mine, I'm not the mathematician. Was just thinking it might be easier to borrow existing code, if possible.
<egg>
well staging would be a particularly advanced thing; just letting you pick an engine that's not lit would be an improvement
<regex>
Certainly.
<SnoopJeDi>
speaking of mathematics, this was this week's happy hour email link: http://physics.aps.org/articles/v10/25 (I'd cc ferram4 if they were here)
<regex>
Just trying to be helpful amongst minds more academic than mine.
<egg>
regex: also, I'm not sure I'd need a tree crawl per se? the parts are tagged with their stage apparently
<egg>
I would need that if I were to inform the user that they are exceeding their available fuel
<egg>
but why would I do that, I can just let them plan impossible burns and watch them run out of fuel and get stranded :-p
<SnoopJeDi>
Just enough rope to hang themselves?
<egg>
SnoopJeDi: in free fall that seems hard
<egg>
!u Ⅱ
<Qboid>
U+2161 ROMAN NUMERAL TWO (Ⅱ)
<regex>
Oh wait, yeah, didn't the craft structure change in recent versions?
<egg>
dunno
<egg>
!u ♈︎
<Qboid>
U+2648 ARIES (♈)
<Qboid>
U+FE0E VARIATION SELECTOR-15 (◌︎)
<egg>
aaargh why is it overrinding my VS-15
<egg>
but not everywhere? WTF
<egg>
maybe it's falling back font for the ♈ and not for the VS-15 and confusing everything?
<egg>
regex: also in the process of testing things for Cardano I played some career mode
<egg>
career mode is weird
<regex>
hah, weird is an understatement
Thomas|AWAY is now known as Thomas
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<GreeningGalaxy>
love it when people email an entire large department at a university with utterly trivialities, and put "please do not respond back to me" at the bottom.
<GreeningGalaxy>
also, automated university-wide advertisements with the standard "because you're a student, you cannot ever unsubscribe from these messages" footer at the bottom.
<Iskierka>
can def filter them though
<GreeningGalaxy>
it's not trivial, because all the automated university-wide mail comes from the same address.
<GreeningGalaxy>
I'd have to set up some kind of regex or something that matches "buy your books at 2000% their value from our bookstore this quarter!" but not "important information about your bookstore account"
<GreeningGalaxy>
I think advertising using that address is plain and simple abuse of the email system, but it's not like I have any recourse.
<kmath>
<Strange_Animals> Tube-lipped nectar bats have the longest tongue relative to body size of any mammal (one and a half times the lengt… https://t.co/C1Gz4vmlyA
<egg>
!acr -add:HXMT Hard X-ray Modulation Telescope
<Qboid>
egg: I added the explanation for this acronym.
<egg>
!wpn UmbralRaptor
* Qboid
gives UmbralRaptor an analytic mathematician
<egg>
!wpn Iskierka
* Qboid
gives Iskierka a contingent 2N3906/McBoatFace hybrid
ferram4 has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
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<UmbralRaptor>
!wpn ferram4
* Qboid
gives ferram4 an engineer
<ferram4>
Ah, yes.
<ferram4>
I shall beat my problems to death with an engineer.
* ferram4
facesmashes nearest problem
<UmbralRaptor>
;8ball can you start an aerospace company with 3 engineers and the truth?
<kmath>
UmbralRaptor: You may rely on it
<SnoopJeDi>
12:23 <@SnoopJeDi> speaking of mathematics, this was this week's happy hour email link: http://physics.aps.org/articles/v10/25 (I'd cc ferram4 if they were here)
<SnoopJeDi>
(hi ferram4!)
<ferram4>
Yes, but it's missing the most important part. The funding for the company. :P
<UmbralRaptor>
Funding is fake, actually.
<UmbralRaptor>
(source: ask any academic about grants(
<UmbralRaptor>
s/s(/s)/
<SnoopJeDi>
or Google
<UmbralRaptor>
?
<Iskierka>
looking at that article, I'm thinking like neural network to try deconstruct the turbulent flow? (though I doubt it'd work)
<Iskierka>
iunno, maybe a sufficiently deep network could do it
<SnoopJeDi>
well, it's less about analyzing flow patterns actually seen and more about "how do you simulate a flow you know will be turbulent"
<SnoopJeDi>
i.e. k-ε vs k-ω is not a trivial choice, and it gets dramatically worse if you're not considering the simplest toy problems
<Iskierka>
true
<SnoopJeDi>
real-world CFD is organized chaos
<Iskierka>
perhaps something like it could be used to judge the likelihood of a flow pattern being accurate
<SnoopJeDi>
so the manifold-y thinking is just a very different tack to take on the problem than the typical "let's just average things out" tack
<SnoopJeDi>
neural networks are definitely a big part of the future of analyses
<Iskierka>
are they? I figured someone's probably thought of it, but was just taking a wild guess at that flow analysis might like their chaos-analysis ability
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<SnoopJeDi>
I don't think I've seen anything that I can recall specifically in CFD
<SnoopJeDi>
but I have a friend who works at Fermilab whose major interest is applying machine learning to accelerator problems
<SnoopJeDi>
it's an exciting and alarming prospect
<SnoopJeDi>
because neural networks are basically made out of ad-hoc
<Iskierka>
"Can you prove the correctness of this?" ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
<SnoopJeDi>
"INDUCTION IS IMPOSSIBLE" (ﾉಥ益ಥ）ﾉ ┻━┻
<SnoopJeDi>
"But hey, at least I didn't use Jet"
egg changed the topic of #kspacademia to: https://gist.github.com/pdn4kd/164b9b85435d87afbec0c3a7e69d3e6d | <egg> the flashlight is tamper-proof, courtesy of the department of mathematics | Dogs are cats. Spiders are cat interferometers. | Космизм сегодня! | Document well, for tomorrow you may get mauled by a ネコバス. | <UmbralRaptor> … one of the other grad students just compared me to nomal O_o | <ferram4>
<egg>
ow
<egg>
UmbralRaptor: the /topic is filling up, I can't add <ferram4> I shall beat my problems to death with an engineer.
<egg>
UmbralRaptor: add some stuff to the gist?
<egg>
!u ﾉಥ益
<Qboid>
U+FF89 HALFWIDTH KATAKANA LETTER NO (ﾉ)
<Qboid>
U+0CA5 KANNADA LETTER THA (ಥ)
<Qboid>
U+76CA CJK IDEOGRAPH-76CA (益)
<egg>
!u
<Qboid>
U+FEFF ZERO WIDTH NO-BREAK SPACE ()
<egg>
why are you using a zwnbsp between the arm and the table
<e_14159>
So, today I built a fruit fly simulator.
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<egg>
e_14159: O_o
<e_14159>
egg: Well, it was supposed to be a car simulator.
<e_14159>
It just ended up looking like fruit flies due to a bug.
<egg>
o_O
<e_14159>
egg: _Oo
<egg>
!csharp String.Concat(from c in "o_O" orderby c select c)
<Qboid>
O_o
<e_14159>
!python import itertools; print([''.join(p) for p in itertools.permutations('o_O')])
<e_14159>
Damn.
<e_14159>
Essentially, it relies on an intelligent driver model which - when the front car is too close - does drive backwards. Since the spawners don't check whether there's a car in the spawn area, this results in cars being spawned extremely close to the previous car.
<e_14159>
Which results in that car rapidly accelerating backwards. It's still trying to visit all waypoints, but the steering angle's too small. That means all of those cars flitter around the map, like fruit flies.
<egg>
that was pretty much the only significant thing we did between بوژگانی and Cantor (it has no user-facing effect, and it's quite big, but it's fun)
<kmath>
<whitequark> OH: (paraphrased) "we use UTC, UT1 and TAI literals in our C++ code so that unit tests can verify that eclipses happen at the right time"