UmbralRaptop changed the topic of #principia to: READ THE FAQ: http://goo.gl/gMZF9H; The current version is Fuchs. We currently target 1.5.1, 1.6.1, 1.7.x, 1.8.1, and 1.9.1. <scott_manley> anyone that doubts the wisdom of retrograde bop needs to get the hell out | https://xkcd.com/323/ | <egg> calculating the influence of lamont on Pluto is a bit silly… | <egg> also 4e16 m * 2^-52 is uncomfortably large
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<discord-> I​diottsandwich. — am I right to say that doing principia right will require less deltaV then stock?
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<discord-> M​yshiko. — depends on how extreme is "right". Principia gives much more options for trading flight duration to delta V.
<discord-> C​onventia. — My experience is that I have less ability to predict how much delta v something will take. But that's mostly because I'm still learning.
<discord-> M​yshiko. — I believe this "less ability to predict" mostly comes from Cape->Moon travels and moon orbit precession cycles. The effects of preccession on launches from Cape are not prohibitive (the way apprentice Flight dynamics officers do it), but it does affect delta-v.
<discord-> M​yshiko. — My experience so far was that launching from Baykonur actually forces one to select launch day and time with a bit more though (due to Baykonur being hopelesly off the Moon plane), and then delta-v required is very stable.
<discord-> M​yshiko. — My experience so far was that launching from Baykonur actually forces one to select launch day and time with a bit more thought (due to Baykonur being hopelesly off the Moon plane), and then delta-v required for Moon flights is very stable. (edited)
<discord-> M​yshiko. — I believe this "less ability to predict" mostly comes from Cape->Moon launches and moon orbit precession cycles. The effects of preccession on launches from Cape are not prohibitive (the way apprentice Flight dynamics officers do it), but it does affect delta-v. (edited)
<discord-> M​yshiko. — to summarize in a different terms: both stock and Principia reward good flight trajectory planning, but Principia rewards excelent flight trajectory planing much more.
<discord-> M​yshiko. — I believe this "less ability to predict" mostly comes from Cape->Moon launches and moon orbit precession cycles. The effects of preccession on launches from Cape are not prohibitive, but it does affect delta-v (the way apprentice Flight dynamics officers do it). (edited)
<discord-> D​amien. — @egg give your cat a treat from me. We lost mine last night 😢
<discord-> S​tandecco. — damn, I'm sorry
<discord-> D​amien. — He didn't come home last night which isn't unusual. Found him dead in our shed (which he likes to sleep in) this morning
<discord-> S​tandecco. — was he killed?
<discord-> S​tandecco. — just looked up what a shed is and I assume it was a natural thing
<discord-> S​tandecco. — still, sorry for his loss
<discord-> D​amien. — Wooden hut for keeping things in
<discord-> D​amien. — It looks like he got his foot caught on something and panicked. Probably heart attack
<discord-> D​amien. — No signs of injury
<discord-> D​amien. — He had a good life though
<discord-> D​amien. — My gf has taken it hard. She found him
<discord-> S​tandecco. — I'm sure he's in cat heaven
<discord-> D​amien. — If it exists, I'm sure he will
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<discord-> B​utcher. — Sad times @Damien
<discord-> B​utcher. — We have 11 cats at the moment, do you want one?
<discord-> D​amien. — I'm going to be exposed as a fraud now though. I've never actually played KSP. It was all him.
<discord-> B​utcher. — Uh oh.
<discord-> B​utcher. — None of my cats play KSP, they occasionally try to jump at the mouse cursor though.
<discord-> S​tandecco. — my cat has no interest whatsoever for anything technology related
<discord-> S​tandecco. — completely ignores it
<discord-> D​amien. — We have another cat. She's got no interest either
<discord-> B​utcher. — We have a slight abundance of cats here atm, 11. Down from a high of 16 last sunday.
<discord-> e​gg. — O_o
<discord-> e​gg. — that is a lot of cats
<discord-> B​utcher. — It is.
<discord-> S​tandecco. — that's a really high cat density
<discord-> B​utcher. — 6 of them are kittens, so really only worth half a cat each.
<discord-> D​amien. — Or twice a cat
<discord-> B​utcher. — We do cat rescue fostering, they're all stray cats that have been picked up.
<discord-> C​onventia. — That's not what I meant by inability to predict. I'm playing from Kourou anyways, so the moon is just fine.
<discord-> B​utcher. — I'm about 130 m/s short on my TLI burn, can I jig my orbit into some sort of ballistic capture?
<discord-> M​yshiko. — you might try exploring if something like this is feasible for your probe.
<discord-> M​yshiko. — > That's not what I meant by inability to predict. I'm playing from Kourou anyways, so the moon is just fine.
<discord-> M​yshiko. — @Conventia Well, feel free to clarify. Kourou is indeed a very nice place.
<discord-> C​onventia. — It seems obvious. 2-body physics has less variables to account for and therefore is fundamentally easier to predict.
<discord-> C​onventia. — I'm not trying to make a magical point. 😛
<discord-> M​yshiko. — got it 🙂
<discord-> B​utcher. — I think it's unlikely I can get into a suitable orbit, I'll probably just turn this orbiter into an impacter.
<discord-> M​yshiko. — well, no harm in exploring the trajectories. Some are rather peculiar.
<_whitenotifier-d13c> [Principia] TangChr starred Principia - https://git.io/JfQko
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<kmath> <johncarlosbaez> @octonion This is why coauthorship exists. It's a little-known fact that in math papers with coauthors, usually a… https://t.co/0Qn3Nr88Bw
<UmbralRaptop> 🐈
<discord-> l​amont. — heh is that john baez the mathematician/physicist?
<discord-> e​gg. — yup
<discord-> l​amont. — hah, that's cool, i know him from sci.physics
<discord-> l​amont. — (also from alt.drugs.psychedelics and hanging out with him at the Shulgin's in SF)
<raptop> pffft
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<discord-> e​gg. — @Sir Mortimer how is KC doing?
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<discord-> e​gg. — @Butcher what is your KSP forum name?
<discord-> B​utcher. — Butcher.
<discord-> e​gg. — clever
<discord-> B​utcher. — Isn't it.
<discord-> e​gg. — looks like someone is looking at kOS Principia integration so I pointed them to you and your issue https://forum.kerbalspaceprogram.com/index.php?/topic/162200-wip151-161-17x-181-principia%E2%80%94version-fuchs-released-2020-05-22%E2%80%94n-body-and-extended-body-gravitation-axial-tilt/page/62/&tab=comments#comment-3802490
<discord-> B​utcher. — Yeah he pinged me on the kos discord earlier.
<discord-> e​gg. — hm
<discord-> e​gg. — should I be on that one
<discord-> e​gg. — so many servers
<discord-> e​gg. — so many channels
<discord-> B​utcher. — Not many principia users on the kos discord. Mostly kids trying to write spacex landing scripts.
<discord-> e​gg. — heh
<discord-> e​gg. — you should direct them to the mechjeb-pvg where lamont can show them how it's done
<discord-> B​utcher. — Incidentally, I'd like prediction.
<discord-> D​RVeyl. — I'm not sure if that sounds disparaging, or if that's largely what you'd generally applaud kids doing.
<discord-> B​utcher. — I'd like to be able to query where something like say the moon will be.
<discord-> e​gg. — ah the moon is different
<discord-> e​gg. — we can predict where the moon will be, and the API reflects that
<discord-> B​utcher. — Atm I rely on keplerian orbits which are adequate but not great.
<discord-> e​gg. — because the player cannot do a thing about the moon
<discord-> e​gg. — anymore than the player can prevent us from releasing
<discord-> B​utcher. — Oh, it works for celestial bodies in the future?
<discord-> e​gg. — those phenomena are correlated and both outside the control of the player
<discord-> e​gg. — yeah, it hits the celestial trajectory so as long as it has been computed at the relevant time (which it is to compute a prediction) it can be queried
<discord-> e​gg. — on the other hand the psychohistory stops at the present
<discord-> B​utcher. — Hmm is there a way to know how far you can predict without just hitting the exception?
<discord-> e​gg. — not at the moment
<discord-> e​gg. — (this is very much designed to match @Sir Mortimer's needs, and since he looks only at the last timewarp step looking outside the bounds is unexpected)
<discord-> e​gg. — @Butcher also, if scimas is on discord, why is he not here?
<discord-> B​utcher. — I'm not sure.
<discord-> s​cimas. — I'm here now, didn't know this server or this channel was a thing until @Butcher suggested I join.
<discord-> e​gg. — hi!
<discord-> e​gg. — mostly we talk about cats and railway switches
<discord-> e​gg. — mostly we talk about cats and railway switches here (edited)
<discord-> s​cimas. — Both topics I'm not much familiar with, but happy to talk about anyway 😄