00:13 <discord-_> e​gg. — @Damien note that most skyboxes out there are badly oriented or mirrored; I made one a while back which is very ugly but correct, which you might be able to use as a reference https://forum.kerbalspaceprogram.com/index.php?/topic/162200-wip151-161-17x-181-principia%E2%80%94version-fubini-released-2020-04-23%E2%80%94n-body-and-extended-body-gravitation-axial-tilt/page/25/&tab=comments#comment-2722222

02:06 <discord-_> P​oisonchocolate. — Is principia that essential to my RO experience that it's worth the performance loss? And do I need to totally relearn ksp to use it?

02:15 <discord-_> D​RVeyl. — Not as simple a question as you might think?

02:15 <discord-_> D​RVeyl. — I'd say most folks play RO without Principia. So "this" essential? No.

02:15 <discord-_> D​RVeyl. — How much performance loss do you actually experience? There's a lot of effort in making Principia not have much impact -- and where you mostly might notice it is if you're trying to warp at rates above 100,000:1. Rates which I think only exist in RO in the first place. And then, the performance cost still depends on how many vessels (and debris) you have, so you can certainly do things to help yo

02:15 <discord-_> D​RVeyl. — Totally relearn KSP? Depends on the lessons you learned. Getting to orbit is basically unchanged. Staying in orbit is more fuzzy. Transferring between planets is still mostly the same, though you have a different planning tool to do it. That planning tool is more complicated than what you know from patched conics, so you have to use it -correctly-, but then it's fine, and others here can tell y

02:20 <discord-_> P​oisonchocolate. — Got it. I think I will hold off on it at the moment but may revisit

03:00 <discord-_> n​ewtype_. — @Damien hey thanks for the comment, i'm figuring it out (mostly that K is a crappy initial flyby route unless you've already used Eve), can't imagine going back to stock now that I can view trajectories like 10 years in advance versus timewarp thru the next orbit and pray that the intercept is slightly closer

05:35 <discord-_> M​yshiko. — > Is principia that essential to my RO experience that it's worth the performance loss? And do I need to totally relearn ksp to use it?

05:35 <discord-_> M​yshiko. — @Poisonchocolate I like Principia so much, I feel it's the best part of the RO experience.

05:37 <discord-_> M​yshiko. — For RSS Principia is a very natural blend and honestly fixes many issues where patched conics just dont work for RSS.

05:37 <discord-_> M​yshiko. — For stock system ... it's a toy system anyway, so Principia is not adding much there.

05:41 <discord-_> M​yshiko. — On i9 9900K I do not observe noticable performance loss for reasonable number of vessels (<20 or so). More cores, faster cores - less impact. Less cores, slower cores - more impact. My wild guess AMD Ryzen Threadripper 3970X is as far as it ever gets there (if one needs to fly 100+ vessels for any reason), but really something like 8900K @ 4.9 is good enouph.

05:42 <discord-_> M​yshiko. — On i9 9900K I do not observe noticable performance loss for reasonable number of vessels (<20 or so). More cores, faster cores - less impact. Less cores, slower cores - more impact. My wild guess AMD Ryzen Threadripper 3970X is as fast as it ever gets there (if one needs to fly 100+ vessels for any reason), but really something like 8900K @ 4.9 is good enouph. (edited)

05:42 <discord-_> M​yshiko. — And i7 7700K (4 core) is still really not bad at all.

05:43 <discord-_> M​yshiko. — On i9 9900K I do not observe noticable performance loss for reasonable number of vessels (<20 or so). More cores, faster cores - less impact. Less cores, slower cores - more impact. My wild guess AMD Ryzen Threadripper 3970X (32 core, 64 threads) is as fast as it ever gets there (if one needs to fly 100+ vessels for any reason), but really something like 8600K @ 4.9 (6 core, 6 threads) is good enou

06:35 <discord-_> P​teropodidae. — Oof, just saw that PhysX comment. Sorry to hear that this particular approach isn’t going to pan out,

06:38 <discord-_> P​teropodidae. — Kind of surprised that PhysX doesn’t try to properly handle that particular behavior. Wonder why...

08:28 <discord-_> D​amien. — @egg thanks for the info. I honestly wouldn't have noticed the skybox thing.

08:28 <discord-_> D​amien. —

08:28 <discord-_> D​amien. — @Poisonchocolate for me personally, principia is an essential mod. In my caseKSP is becoming more about n-body trick shots than anything else. You can 100% play without it, and it's easier in a lot of cases to do so but I doubt anyone playing RO came here for easier gameplay.

08:28 <discord-_> D​amien. — Principia is the good kind of difficulty imo, that forces you to learn a new skill. It's not the bad kind of difficulty that's just grind and and box ticking like crew training. Just my opinion so take it with a pinch of salt. The UI takes a bit of effort to learn but it's not that bad. My advice (which I didn't personally follow) is test it out in a non-RO setting (stock, RSS/SMURFF etc) first. Oth

08:28 <discord-_> D​amien. — It has a performance hit but it's manageable on a decent pic and with proper consideration to craft numbers (get rid of that debris) and trajectory prediction calculation settings (high precision, long duration = bad).

08:28 <discord-_> D​amien. — @egg thanks for the info. I honestly wouldn't have noticed the skybox thing.

08:28 <discord-_> D​amien. —

08:28 <discord-_> D​amien. — @Poisonchocolate for me personally, principia is an essential mod. In my case KSP is becoming more about n-body trick shots than anything else. You can 100% play without it, and it's easier in a lot of cases to do so but I doubt anyone playing RO came here for easier gameplay.

08:29 <discord-_> D​amien. — Principia is the good kind of difficulty imo, that forces you to learn a new skill. It's not the bad kind of difficulty that's just grind and and box ticking like crew training. Just my opinion so take it with a pinch of salt. The UI takes a bit of effort to learn but it's not that bad. My advice (which I didn't personally follow) is test it out in a non-RO setting (stock, RSS/SMURFF etc) first. Oth

08:29 <discord-_> D​amien. — It has a performance hit but it's manageable on a decent pic and with proper consideration to craft numbers (get rid of that debris) and trajectory prediction calculation settings (high precision, long duration = bad). (edited)

08:30 <discord-_> D​amien. — @egg thanks for the info. I honestly wouldn't have noticed the skybox thing.

08:30 <discord-_> D​amien. —

08:30 <discord-_> D​amien. — @Poisonchocolate for me personally, principia is an essential mod. In my case KSP is becoming more about n-body trick shots than anything else. You can 100% play without it, and it's easier in a lot of cases to do so but I doubt anyone playing RO came here for easier gameplay.

08:30 <discord-_> D​amien. — Principia is the good kind of difficulty imo, that forces you to learn a new skill. It's not the bad kind of difficulty that's just grind and and box ticking like crew training. Just my opinion so take it with a pinch of salt. The UI takes a bit of effort to learn but it's not that bad. My advice (which I didn't personally follow) is test it out in a non-RO setting (stock, RSS/SMURFF etc) first. Oth

08:30 <discord-_> D​amien. — It has a performance hit but it's manageable, if not unnoticeable on a decent PC and with proper consideration to craft numbers (get rid of that debris) and trajectory prediction calculation settings (high precision, long duration = bad). (edited)

11:32 <discord-> P​rofiremu23. — So i tested a KRASH sim

11:32 <discord-> P​rofiremu23. — i putted a random stuff into moon orbit

11:33 <discord-> P​rofiremu23. — And my experince is the Moon tried to put the stuff into a crash course

11:34 <discord-> P​rofiremu23. — Moon orbits hard to maintence right?

11:35 <discord-> D​amien. — they're not stable apart from certain specific inclinations, no

11:35 <discord-> D​amien. — but that's the same irl

11:35 <discord-> P​rofiremu23. — So inclination is a tip for moon orbits?

11:35 <discord-> D​amien. — yes. a polar orbit will be very stable

11:36 <discord-> P​rofiremu23. — I try that

11:36 <discord-> P​rofiremu23. — Plus side, i can maintain communications both sides of the Moon

11:36 <discord-> D​amien. — if you want to get good with principia in RSS, I can strongly recommend setting up an RSS/SMURFF install

11:36 <discord-> P​rofiremu23. — I try that

11:37 <discord-> P​rofiremu23. — too

11:37 <discord-> D​amien. — if you want to send a probe to the moon using a low energy transfer in RP-1, it's a good idea to learn how they work in your practice install, with an easy to control craft

11:37 <discord-> P​rofiremu23. — Plus i can use HyperEdit?

11:37 <discord-> D​amien. — no

11:37 <discord-> D​amien. — not compatible with principia

11:37 <discord-> P​rofiremu23. — Stabillty issues?

11:38 <discord-> D​amien. — principia handles the positions of objects, hyperedit uses the patched conics system

11:38 <discord-> D​amien. — a workaround is hacking gravity, moving it then reenabling gravity

11:38 <discord-> P​rofiremu23. — So i need to use the orbit place cheat

11:38 <discord-> D​amien. — but I don't recommend it

11:38 <discord-> P​rofiremu23. — So manually?

11:38 <discord-> D​amien. — why do anything? if you need to do something, launch into orbit first

11:38 <discord-> P​rofiremu23. — Hmmm

11:39 <discord-> D​amien. — parking orbit design is half the battle

11:39 <discord-> D​amien. — if it's on a practice install then you can even use infinite fuel on the ascent, who cares

11:39 <discord-> P​rofiremu23. — Okay

11:40 <discord-> D​amien. — cheat your way to the perfect parking orbit (inclinaton etc) then detach your practice craft and continue

11:40 <discord-> P​rofiremu23. — Good tip

11:40 <discord-> D​amien. — low energy stuff requires very small burns so plan accordingly

11:41 <discord-> D​amien. — the final stage can be a tiny probe with a throttled down monoprop engine

11:42 <discord-> D​amien. — if you've already mastered getting to orbit, transferring to other bodies etc then learn the quirks of precessing orbits (sunsync, molniya, tundra etc), L-point orbits, low energy transfers, gravity assists etc

11:43 <discord-> P​rofiremu23. — Okay so i practice in a non-RO KSP save

11:43 <discord-> D​amien. — I still don't fully understand it all with reference to the principia UI (specifically multi-flyby gravity assists) but it's a solid head start

11:44 <discord-> D​amien. — try a geosat too. that one took me by surprise

11:44 <discord-> P​rofiremu23. — Later i try i Voyage style

11:44 <discord-> D​amien. — good luck, gravity assists are the hardest thing I've tried 🙂

11:45 <discord-> D​amien. — we need someone good at it to do a tutorial

11:45 <discord-> P​rofiremu23. — My moon enconter is taken 13 days

11:45 <discord-> P​rofiremu23. — sceond orbit is given a encounter

11:45 <discord-> D​amien. — that's a long trip, what route are you taking?

11:45 <discord-> P​rofiremu23. — Low energy transfer

11:46 <discord-> D​amien. — nice

11:46 <discord-> P​rofiremu23. — In RP-1

11:46 <discord-> P​rofiremu23. — coz i dont have the avionics

11:46 <discord-> P​rofiremu23. — to direct burns

11:46 <discord-> D​amien. — that's a good idea

11:46 <discord-> D​amien. — I take you have a multirestart engine?

11:46 <discord-> P​rofiremu23. — No

11:47 <discord-> P​rofiremu23. — RCS

11:47 <discord-> P​rofiremu23. — yes

11:47 <discord-> D​amien. — ah

11:47 <discord-> D​amien. — I take it you have a multirestart engine? (edited)

11:47 <discord-> D​amien. — so single burn launch to ellitpical orbit, then use RCS to fine tune?

11:47 <discord-> D​amien. — so single burn launch to elliptical orbit, then use RCS to fine tune? (edited)

11:48 <discord-> D​amien. — or do you have a TLI stage that you coasted with in orbit?

11:48 <discord-> P​rofiremu23. — Yes

11:48 <discord-> P​rofiremu23. — Areobee AJ-10

11:48 <discord-> P​rofiremu23. — 280 kg

11:49 <discord-> D​amien. — nice mission

11:49 <discord-> P​rofiremu23. — transfer stage with HTP was the monopropellant

11:49 <discord-> P​rofiremu23. — I do 2 times

11:49 <discord-> D​amien. — if you have RCS on your probe you might even be able to capture into an L1 or L2 halo orbit

11:50 <discord-> P​rofiremu23. — No, the aerobee has 2900-3000 m/s

11:50 <discord-> D​amien. — ah

11:50 <discord-> P​rofiremu23. — HTP RCS is 300 m/s of Delta-v

11:51 <discord-> P​rofiremu23. — The third one is direct transfer, so i was lucky to a direct

11:51 <discord-> P​rofiremu23. — impact to the Moon

11:52 <discord-> D​amien. — nice

11:53 <discord-> D​amien. — I took a break a while back because I was burned out with RP-1 and the caveman life so I'm playing JNSQ at the moment. I'll be back though and try to do a non-caveman career with some decent tech and fun missions

11:53 <discord-> P​rofiremu23. — https://discord.com/channels/319857228905447436/331813395424739339/709405371936276480 Check my Lune-1 mission report

11:54 <discord-> P​rofiremu23. — I invented Atlas in early 1957

11:54 <discord-> P​rofiremu23. — Then my stone age rocket era is ended

11:54 <discord-> D​amien. — yeah I saw that report. nice job

11:55 <discord-> P​rofiremu23. — Lune-2 is to the same thing, Lune-3 impacted after the direct burn

11:56 <discord-> P​rofiremu23. — I planning to Lune-4 and 5 to be orbiters

11:56 <discord-> P​rofiremu23. — Lune-6 to 10 being landers

11:57 <discord-> P​rofiremu23. — So i become a low-energy TLE expert

11:58 <discord-> P​rofiremu23. — by accident

11:58 <discord-> P​rofiremu23. — when i played the manuver nodes

11:59 <discord-> P​rofiremu23. — Nice talking to you, i back

13:32 <_whitenotifier-d13c> [Principia] hdszcg-ksp commented on issue #2557: The Principia DLL failed to load. - https://git.io/Jf48A

13:39 <_whitenotifier-d13c> [Principia] hdszcg-ksp forked the repository - https://git.io/Jf44m

15:24 <_whitenotifier-d13c> [Principia] lolotux69 commented on issue #2557: The Principia DLL failed to load. - https://git.io/Jf4Ey

15:25 <_whitenotifier-d13c> [Principia] lolotux69 commented on issue #2557: The Principia DLL failed to load. - https://git.io/Jf4EF

15:30 <_whitenotifier-d13c> [Principia] lolotux69 commented on issue #2557: The Principia DLL failed to load. - https://git.io/Jf4uZ

15:44 <_whitenotifier-d13c> [Principia] lolotux69 commented on issue #2557: The Principia DLL failed to load. - https://git.io/Jf4zs

16:18 <discord-> D​amien. — @egg do you need to write a strongly worded email to the physx team? 😄

16:20 <_whitenotifier-d13c> [Principia] pleroy commented on issue #2557: The Principia DLL failed to load. - https://git.io/Jf4g7

16:25 <_whitenotifier-d13c> [Principia] pleroy commented on issue #2557: The Principia DLL failed to load. - https://git.io/Jf42e

16:53 <_whitenotifier-d13c> [Principia] lolotux69 commented on issue #2557: The Principia DLL failed to load. - https://git.io/Jf4ak

16:54 <_whitenotifier-d13c> [Principia] lolotux69 edited a comment on issue #2557: The Principia DLL failed to load. - https://git.io/Jf4ak

16:59 <_whitenotifier-d13c> [Principia] lolotux69 edited a comment on issue #2557: The Principia DLL failed to load. - https://git.io/Jf4ak

17:22 <_whitenotifier-d13c> [Principia] pleroy commented on issue #2557: The Principia DLL failed to load. - https://git.io/Jf4V9

17:56 <_whitenotifier-d13c> [Principia] pleroy opened pull request #2568: Fix a clang error - https://git.io/Jf4rI

18:03 <_whitenotifier-d13c> [Principia] eggrobin labeled pull request #2568: Fix a clang error - https://git.io/Jf4rI

18:07 <_whitenotifier-d13c> [Principia] Pending. Build queued… - 

18:07 <_whitenotifier-d13c> [Principia] Pending. Building… - http://casanova.westeurope.cloudapp.azure.com:8080/job/Principia/4282/

18:27 <_whitenotifier-d13c> [Principia] Success. Build finished. - http://casanova.westeurope.cloudapp.azure.com:8080/job/Principia/4282/

18:37 <discord-> e​gg. — nah, we have a plan of sorts

18:37 <discord-> e​gg. — right now I have code that finally handles free body rotation correctly, but it exhibits strong Frobenius-type precession; but I have a good idea why, it is time to do some splittings

18:58 <_whitenotifier-d13c> [Principia] pleroy closed pull request #2568: Fix a clang error - https://git.io/Jf4rI

18:58 <_whitenotifier-d13c> [Principia] pleroy pushed 2 commits to master [+0/-0/±2] https://git.io/Jf46Y

18:58 <_whitenotifier-d13c> [Principia] pleroy 0d9c8cb - Fix a clang error.

18:58 <_whitenotifier-d13c> [Principia] pleroy 05281ea - Merge pull request #2568 from pleroy/Clang Fix a clang error

18:58 <_whitenotifier-d13c> [Principia] Pending. queued - https://dev.azure.com/mockingbirdnest/445d7b9d-0318-42e3-857f-b69d40b1ed1b/_build/results?buildId=699

18:58 <_whitenotifier-d13c> [Principia] Pending. queued - https://dev.azure.com/mockingbirdnest/445d7b9d-0318-42e3-857f-b69d40b1ed1b/_build/results?buildId=700

18:59 <_whitenotifier-d13c> [Principia] Pending. in progress - https://dev.azure.com/mockingbirdnest/445d7b9d-0318-42e3-857f-b69d40b1ed1b/_build/results?buildId=700

18:59 <_whitenotifier-d13c> [Principia] Pending. in progress - https://dev.azure.com/mockingbirdnest/445d7b9d-0318-42e3-857f-b69d40b1ed1b/_build/results?buildId=699

20:00 <_whitenotifier-d13c> [Principia] Success. #700 succeeded - https://dev.azure.com/mockingbirdnest/445d7b9d-0318-42e3-857f-b69d40b1ed1b/_build/results?buildId=700

20:03 <_whitenotifier-d13c> [Principia] Success. #699 succeeded - https://dev.azure.com/mockingbirdnest/445d7b9d-0318-42e3-857f-b69d40b1ed1b/_build/results?buildId=699

23:18 <discord-> D​amien. — it's not RSS so I can't post it in #missionreports but I've just had a nice bit of help from principia to turn a mission to deorbit and destroy a defunct Minmus (JNSQ) scansat into a Mun scansat for 27m/s

23:18 <discord-> B​utcher. — I had a defunct lunar sat, it crashed into the moon.

23:18 <discord-> D​amien. — pics in #other-games

23:19 <discord-> B​utcher. — Because mascons.

23:19 <discord-> e​gg. — I suppose you could post Principia pictures here

23:19 <discord-> B​utcher. — Egg is less strict than many other channels.

23:19 <discord-> D​amien. — lol I know

23:19 <discord-> e​gg. — what with this being the Principia channel

23:19 <discord-> e​gg. — or rather the egg channel

23:19 <discord-> D​amien. — it's ok, I'm not the only one posting non-RSS pics in there

23:20 <discord-> B​utcher. — @egg woah woah woah, let's not get *on* topic.

23:20 <discord-> D​amien. — From this:

23:20 <discord-> D​amien. — https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/480397772248580098/710270343771586572/screenshot146.png

23:21 <discord-> D​amien. — to this:

23:21 <discord-> D​amien. — https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/480397772248580098/710270413665468470/screenshot152.png

23:21 <discord-> D​amien. — for 27m/s via this

23:21 <discord-> D​amien. — https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/480397772248580098/710270521446629406/screenshot147.png

23:21 <discord-> D​amien. — this

23:21 <discord-> D​amien. — https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/480397772248580098/710270548499759129/screenshot151.png

23:21 <discord-> D​amien. — and this

23:21 <discord-> D​amien. — https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/480397772248580098/710270598105792592/screenshot150.png

23:22 <discord-> D​amien. — my original plan was to just deorbit it and let it smash into minmus

23:23 <discord-> D​amien. — but instead in 27d it'll have a new job mapping the mun