UmbralRaptor changed the topic of #kspacademia to: https://gist.github.com/pdn4kd/164b9b85435d87afbec0c3a7e69d3e6d | Dogs are cats. Spiders are cat interferometers. | Космизм сегодня! | Document well, for tomorrow you may get mauled by a ネコバス. | <UmbralRaptor> … one of the other grad students just compared me to nomal O_o | <ferram4> I shall beat my problems to death with an engineer.
<bofh>
so if your unicode is getting dropped
<bofh>
!u ?₃
<Qboid>
U+1D4AF MATHEMATICAL SCRIPT CAPITAL T (?)
<Qboid>
U+2083 SUBSCRIPT THREE (₃)
<egg|zzz|egg>
yes, but it has, in it, the face that you make when it is shown to you :D
<egg|zzz|egg>
no I did get the rest
<egg|zzz|egg>
but, (0,0).
<egg|zzz|egg>
bofh: what is that, in saner notation?
<bofh>
I, uh, am actually still unsure. I *think* ISO(4)?
<egg|zzz|egg>
bofh: waitwaitwait, it uses direct sums and calls the script letters algebras, so they're not Lie groups, right? it's the T that's a Lie group?
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<egg|zzz|egg>
bofh: also any idea about InfectedRaptor's precessing orbits? I'm really failing to find a frame where I can look at that sanely
<bofh>
egg|zzz|egg: yes you're right, the scripts are the associated algebras.
<bofh>
also I think all the frames you can view the problem in preserve insanity :/
<egg|zzz|egg>
bofh: ... is insanity a first integral,
<InfectedRaptor>
With sufficiently convoluted analytic solutions, yes.
<kmath>
egg|phone|egg: You cajole your scientific instrumentation into working by telling them that the flight computer is an iPhone. Having decided you're quite good at rocket science, you conclude that the next logical step is to start manufacturing electric cars as well.
<egg|phone|egg>
Bofh: ↑
<bofh>
I object I am NOT going to pull an Elon Musk.
<egg|phone|egg>
;mission
<kmath>
egg|phone|egg: You try using kmath's ;mission function to plan your space program. Your legs are staged off below the knee.
<InfectedRaptor>
;mission
<kmath>
InfectedRaptor: You catch your hair in the hatch as it closes, and are forced to spend the duration of the flight with your head stuck to the wall. You activate the self-destruct sequence and all's right with the world!
<InfectedRaptor>
uhm
<bofh>
;mission
<kmath>
bofh: You smuggle a bottle of 99% ABV münshine aboard. kmath's got 900 outcomes, but this ain't one.
<bofh>
Nah, I much prefer 112% STBV sulfuric acid. :P
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<InfectedRaptor>
"Pure disulfuric acid itself is a solid at room temperature, melting at 36 °C and rarely used either in the laboratory or industrial processes."
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* InfectedRaptor
is amused at the relatively high melting point for some reason.
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<InfectedRaptor>
"When SO3 is added to water, rather than simply dissolving, it tends to form a fine mist of sulfuric acid, which is difficult to manage." Yet another reason chemistry is scary.
<bofh>
"which is difficult to manage" ya don't say
<bofh>
fun fact: highly concentrated sulfuric acid actually makes for a very good lubricant.
<bofh>
it's extremely highly viscous (hence "oil of vitriol") & in some cases one of few things that won't be eaten up by whatever nasty chemicals you're working with.
<InfectedRaptor>
"Suppose you just hatched from an egg and don’t know anything about astrophysics. You brush off a loose feather and look at our solar system for the first time."
<APlayer>
Actually, I'd rather not, it wants me to link it to my account
<APlayer>
Uh, so if I have a vector (0/0/1) in one coordinate system, the same vector in a differently oriented/mirrored system (for an easy example, let's say left handed and right handed) and an arbitary vector in the first coordinate system... How would I go about converting those?
<APlayer>
Converting the vector from the first system to the second one, that is
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<egg|afk|egg>
UmbralRaptor: new type II cat observation
<UmbralRaptor>
Yay, cat.
<egg|afk|egg>
closest observation of a type II cat yet (nevertheless the two populations remain clearly distinct)
<APlayer>
egg: As I understand it, it is able to harvest the complete food provided by its neighbourhood system?
<egg|afk|egg>
nah, it's metal-poor
<egg|afk|egg>
(or does it mean that it has hydrogen in its spectrum?)
<egg|afk|egg>
UmbralRaptor: which classification are we basing this nomenclature on
<UmbralRaptor>
egg|afk|egg: kinematics, as we do not have any spectroscopic data, and have not performed photometric analysis on existing data.
<UmbralRaptor>
Uh, having hydrogen in a star's spectrum doesn't make it metal poor. More of a temperature vaguely near 10 000 K
<UmbralRaptor>
Metal rich stars top out around 6-10% metals, IIRC.
<UmbralRaptor>
(Ignore post main sequence mass loss, that's separate)
<egg|afk|egg>
UmbralRaptor: no, mostly looking at supernova types vs. star populations
<egg|afk|egg>
both of which have Very Astronomical Nomenclature
* egg|afk|egg
gives UmbralRaptor a type II cake
<egg|afk|egg>
!wpn whitequark
* Qboid
gives whitequark a treasonous trie which strongly resembles a life
* UmbralRaptor
eats 22/7 slices.
<egg|afk|egg>
!wpn Fiora
* Qboid
gives Fiora a Lyman truffle
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<UmbralRaptor>
1216-980 Å?
<egg|afk|egg>
that's a smol truffle
egg|afk|egg is now known as egg
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<UmbralRaptor>
!wa Lyman series
<Qboid>
UmbralRaptor: hydrogen I (neutral hydrogen) | lyman series atomic spectral lines:
<bofh>
oh great I've just been asked to implement numerically stable real-valued modified BesselK derivatives
<kmath>
<sbagley> V interesting point here: When lecture started, it was a revolutionary pedagogy designed to capitalize on the best… https://t.co/aVAbek5xUi
<bofh>
I seriously hope they mean derivatives wrt x and not derivatives wrt \nu.
<UmbralRaptor>
"Intelligence Community Virtual Career
<kmath>
<photoEphemeris> In case you ever wondered why getting time zones and daylight saving time 100% accurate is an impossible task - fro… https://t.co/ZguhpJFJXn
<bofh>
whitequark: this terrible thing where you show up to lecture, the prof asks you questions, you push buttons on a 433MHz ISM band remote control based on which of the answers you think it is or if it's true or false or w/e and this counts to like 5% - 10% of your grade.
<egg>
bofh: I had never heard of this
<bofh>
egg: lucky
<egg>
I was happier never to have heard of it
<whitequark>
bofh: wtf
<whitequark>
bofh: the obvious choice is to sniff for it and then make a device that clicks the class consensus
<bofh>
whitequark: yep, I did actually look at the packet format at some point and there appears to be zero crypto so this is indeed trivial to do.
<egg>
whitequark: but what if the class is majoritarily wrong
<bofh>
egg: who cares, statistically you're still going to get >50% results.
<bofh>
egg: and some profs literally just use it as participation marks, in those cases you could literally just RNG the packets every time.
<whitequark>
bofh: that shit can't possibly involve a public key cryptosystem
<whitequark>
and everything else is likely trivially bypassable and/or breakable
<bofh>
whitequark: there is literally none. packets are unauthenticated beyond a hard-coded remote id# and the key to packet mapping is obvious.
<whitequark>
yeah I mean, that *concept* of a device
<bofh>
ahh. yeah, you're right.
<whitequark>
if you add PKI into it, its ROI becomes so far lower than zero
<whitequark>
that no one is gonna use it
<whitequark>
academia IT is nightmarish enough on its own
<bofh>
Yep. Like it was already nontrivial to setup the infra for this from what I've overheard, in many places, PKI would require a total upgrade and break constantly.
<bofh>
Plus there's no mass-market device that automatically does this for you, so you have to implement it yourself, at which point I will argue that if you're clever enough to do that you deserve not just the 5% or whatever, but more (and if it's an EE class, just pass the whole damn thing :P).
<bofh>
Honestly the only way to dramatically decrease cheating rates in undergrad is to stop using BSc degrees as fucking certifications for employment/immigration.
<bofh>
It would improve the quality of instruction dramatically, too.
<egg>
bofh: is strong prevalence of cheating at the BSc level a particularly US-specific thing? I wasn't particularly aware that it was a big thing here (but then I didn't actively look for that)
<egg>
bofh: amusingly here evaluation was *entirely* at the end-of-semester (or in the first couple of years, end-of-year) exams, none of that midterm stuff (let alone clicky thingies counting for some part or whatever)
<egg>
there was *one* course where they did a midterm iirc, but that was an oddity
<bofh>
so I managed to get lucky in that only ~75% of my courses in my undergrad had midterms. only.
<bofh>
egg: so keep in mind a lot of it is also in US/CA if you're on a student visa renewal of that is tied to continued academic success. so if you fail a term you very easily can (and often do) get deported, even if otherwise you still are in good standing with the university (often you are allowed to go back if the university okays it, which they do, but if you basically don't start this process literally
<bofh>
immediately you prolly will be doing it from ...
<bofh>
... PRC or whereever your primary place of citizenship is from).
<bofh>
I'm not 100% sure on the precise specifics but there is a *lot* of pressure on international students in undergrad. And locals are lazy but still realize they need the fucking certificate despite the fact that they don't care about the material (and often rightfully realize that they won't need it in their chosen careers much, and what they do need they can just learn at those times).
<egg>
bofh: in france they tend to be fairly serious about preventing cheating, so you write national exams on standardized anonimizable paper given to you at the exam, and you have coloured draft paper (two colours for the room, all your neighbours have the other colour)
<bofh>
So yeah, I think it's a North American thing but it really is pervasive.
<egg>
at ETHZ it was just "bring x pages of notes, and your own paper" :-p
<bofh>
Heh. In my case it was just paper was handed to us and collected afterwards, but for open-book finals we could bring any notes, and otherwise we often could fill out a single sheet with whatever we wanted on it.
<Fiora>
i don't think it's particularly pervasive here insomuch as colleges will expel the hell out of you for it
<Fiora>
like, people do cheat, but it's not considered a matter of "cheat or die", but rather "cheat at your own risk"
<bofh>
^
<Fiora>
if you want somewhere that cheating is absolutely pervasive, try india
<egg>
oh yeah
<bofh>
Speaking of which, I found my Real Analysis 1 final exam, with the funniest set of instructions on it.
<bofh>
And yeah, India is... it's really something else.
<egg>
:D
<Fiora>
*that's* pervasive cheating, i.e. everyone is practically expected to cheat, even if they're extremely smart and good at the material
<Fiora>
i think it also depends on the school. some are more tolerant, others less so
<Fiora>
here, that is
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<egg>
bofh: I do like the idea of the 2-coloured draft paper tho (also the anonymous paper is cool, you write your name and other identifying information onto a corner whose back is black and glue that folded)
<bofh>
the bicolour draft paper is neat but I'm not sure what problem it solves.
<egg>
bofh: student exchanging sheets
<bofh>
IME most exam-time cheating is either "person looking over at other person's paper" or "person consulting $smartphone, either surreptitiously or in $restroom or w/e"
<egg>
bofh: so the tables are spaced far enough to make the first infeasible; most of those procedures were designed before the second was a problem
<egg>
but when I took the bac I had to surrender my phone at the entrance and pick it back up when leaving
<bofh>
Heh. That actually is reasonable.
<egg>
bofh: some of these procedures are really thorough because there are some exams in france that mean you get some administrative job, so contestations of the exam results go to the administrative tribunal and everything is a mess
<egg>
bofh: anecdote re. transfinite induction; I asked Marc Burger (back before I went to ETHZ, but I knew him because his stepson went to the same school) whether he could recommend a book in German, so I could learn some German
<egg>
bofh: he recommended Moderne Algebra :D
<egg>
bofh: not sure I learned much *useful* german from that, but I sure learned some maths
<egg>
bofh: in particular even the mathematical terminology changed (Bourbaki!)
<egg>
bijektiv was eineindeutig, etc.
<bofh>
LOL
<bofh>
Wow, that's interesting and honestly kind of surprising.
<egg>
bofh: but hey, that's where I learned about transfinite induction :D
<kmath>
<stephentyrone> The problem with explaining non-computability of the reals is that we can’t even describe almost all the non-computable numbers.
<Fiora>
oh of course
<egg>
so you know this stupid induction joke that proves that all natural numbers are interesting?
<UmbralRaptor>
egg: while(1) { ???(); }
<egg>
with the axiom of choice and transfinite induction, all reals are interesting! :D
<egg>
(but you can't describe almost all of them :D)