egg|nomz|egg changed the topic of #kspacademia to: https://gist.github.com/pdn4kd/164b9b85435d87afbec0c3a7e69d3e6d | Dogs are cats. Spiders are cat interferometers. | Космизм сегодня! | Document well, for tomorrow you may get mauled by a ネコバス. | <UmbralRaptor> egg|nomz|egg: generally if your eyes are dewing over, that's not the weather. | <ferram4> I shall beat my problems to death with an engineer.
<UmbralRaptor> Prank idea: replace your lab's magnets with electrets.
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<bofh> UmbralRaptor: ROFL
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<UmbralRaptor> Upside of this Hawaii thing: it's nice to know that 2018 can't do a proper volcano apocalypse.
<bofh> UmbralRaptor: indeed.
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<iximeow> yet...
<iximeow> still thinking about 34" telescopes doing balet
<iximeow> need to figure out how to get my celestron to listen to a computer
<iximeow> oh there are two l's in that word
<UmbralRaptor> iximeow: supposedly the MINERVA telescopes (0.7 m) can slew at 20˚/s. And operators report that they are basically silent.
<iximeow> oh gosh
<UmbralRaptor> To be fair, they cost something silly like $200k.
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<egg> !wpn UmbralRaptor
* Qboid gives UmbralRaptor a code-switching neutron
<egg> UmbralRaptor: hm that tumbler is interesting
<egg> s/er/r
<Qboid> egg meant to say: UmbralRaptor: hm that tumblr is interesting
<egg> !wpn bofh
* Qboid gives bofh an AVX insulator
<egg> !wpn whitequark
* Qboid gives whitequark a 50Ω refrigerator
<kmath> <Moudhy> This Old Babylonian school text from Nippur not only preserves part of a cuneiform lexical text known today as “Pro… https://t.co/oi6iZEDLuK
<UmbralRaptor> Hm
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<egg> oh I saw those street names in the thing about the excavations where the ea-nasir tablets were found http://sisterofiris.tumblr.com/post/172922397064/were-studying-urs-clergy-in-one-of-my-classes
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<kmath> <Moudhy> A short thread of resources, particularly #openaccess materials in English, to learn Akkadian, the earliest atteste… https://t.co/RamPaTdTbN
<egg> cc UmbralRaptor, bofh, et al.
<kmath> <ProjectCANZ> Ur-Nammu’s scribe had a pet cat https://t.co/1h4PmUlYgO
<kmath> <ScribeEAE> Ancient #procrastination: In this Neo #Assyrian letter, the scholar Adad-šumu-uṣur excuses himself for a late respo… https://t.co/fTSPuyTbLx
<egg> bofh: thread on that sign in your name https://twitter.com/cooleiform/status/942309605392240645
<kmath> <cooleiform> Accurate or not, I find it oddly appropriate that at least one online source (https://t.co/ampQQzOPMm) translates d… https://t.co/g1A78FP0lx
<UmbralRaptor> egg: After (I possibly fail) finals?
* UmbralRaptor also 🗡 sleep.
<egg> !wpn UmbralRaptor
* Qboid gives UmbralRaptor an AVX divergence
* UmbralRaptor slows down float math dramatically.
<whitequark> lol
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<egg> !wpn whitequark
* Qboid gives whitequark an Octave ray tube
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* egg should go to work
<kmath> <KhaledGhetas> @0x0ade @tha_rami It makes sense actually, if you assume all programming languages are written LTR (which is almost true).
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<egg|work|egg> !wpn whitequark
* Qboid gives whitequark a monopolar barber
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<bofh> egg: oh neat, a lot of TIL
<bofh> thanks
<kmath> <cooleiform> Accurate or not, I find it oddly appropriate that at least one online source (https://t.co/ampQQzOPMm) translates d… https://t.co/g1A78FP0lx
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* UmbralRaptor gives bofh a typhonic beast.
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<egg> !wpn UmbralRaptor
* Qboid gives UmbralRaptor an oscillator-like paranotion
<egg> !wpn bofh
* Qboid gives bofh a lenticular frꙮg
<egg> !wpn whitequark
* Qboid gives whitequark a hatpin
<whitequark> !wpn egg
* Qboid gives egg a starboard alternating odonate
<whitequark> egg vorbis
<egg> котяchrome
<UmbralRaptor> Please do not lossy compress the egg.
<egg> Principia ate a disk #1809
<Qboid> [#1809] title: JOURNAL files are filling disc space without limit | I have just found out that Principia created 429 GB of JOURNAL files on my computer - is this possible to add some kind of automatic file deleteing mechanism or something? | https://github.com/mockingbirdnest/principia/issues/1809
<e14159> 429GB of disk? Not bad.
<egg> well, everything that goes between the C# layer and the main (C++) part of principia
<e14159> I'm just wondering how long that took to accumulate.
<egg> hm
<egg> my usual test missions (to create a journal for profile-guided optimizations) produce maybe 5 GiB?
<egg> if you stare at map view a lot you'll probably produce more of it
* e14159 nods
<egg> (every segment of our trajectories will yield a journal entry)
<egg> bofh: UmbralRaptor: apologies, that clay tablet was a dog (claws in the print are a dead giveaway) https://twitter.com/Apkallatu/status/988076253143019526
<kmath> <Apkallatu> Dogs - walking all over your bricks since 2100 BC @pennmuseum https://t.co/5A5Mc3CwHW
<UmbralRaptor> hm
<whitequark> wtf is Krakensbane
<whitequark> The Krakensbane system is used to overcome the floating point precision errors that occur due to the environment size.
<whitequark> oh
<e14159> A.k.a. sane programming practices?
<UmbralRaptor> π71818: less so than you'd eggspect?
<UmbralRaptor> My understanding is that the floating origin systems for position and velocity are different.
<UmbralRaptor> s/81/82/
<Qboid> UmbralRaptor meant to say: π71828: less so than you'd eggspect?
<e14159> At a first glance, this seems strange. But they might've had their reasons?
<egg> whitequark: oh
<egg> whitequark: it's double-double where they factored out the high part for some inane reason
<whitequark> wgat
<egg> whitequark: and there's an *entirely separate* system for the position, krakensbane is the velocity
<egg> floating origin handles the position
<egg> krakensbane does ~the same for the velocity
<egg> whitequark: do you understand now why there is the journaled iron curtain of the KSP-to-principia interface
<egg> e14159: I have stopped looking for reasons in KSP
<egg> remember the ladder force?
<kmath> <eggleroy> Bug #1415: Kerbals holding ladders are immune to gravity, the ladder itself imbues them with weight. KSP is strange. https://t.co/AD3ma7om4s
<Qboid> [#1415] title: Vessel relative velocities change when switching to EVA | Park 2 vessels close to each other with as less relative speed as possible. Perform EVA from anyone of the vessels. The other vessel starts moving away with relative speed of about 2-3 m/s (as reported by the target frame navball.) Attaching a save file where this can be immediately verified.... | https://github.com/moc
<Qboid> kingbirdnest/principia/issues/1415
<e14159> I'm still hung up on the fact that the kraken could happen at all.
<egg> e14159: the velocities are all body-centred nonrotating (unless you're low and the frame is rotating and then they apply the apparent forces by hand but anyway) so they get large, so that smol oscillations get discretized? this is all single-precision float in the physics engine anyway
<egg> whitequark: not double-double, sorry, double+single
<egg> mostly
<whitequark> wtf
<egg> bofh: whitequark: "it has not escaped our notice" https://forum.kerbalspaceprogram.com/index.php?/topic/162200-wip122-131-142-principia%E2%80%94version-cramer-released-2018-04-16%E2%80%94n-body-and-extended-body-gravitation-axial-tilt/&page=41&tab=comments#comment-3373259
<whitequark> ... ECONNREFUSED?
<egg> uh
<egg> wat
<egg> whitequark: it works here? do the ksp servers not like you?
<whitequark> yep it works via vpn too
* UmbralRaptor semi randomly blames ITAR.
<bofh> egg: LOL
<egg> whitequark: the floating origin and krakensbane stuff arose very organically (and everything is a mess)
<whitequark> grass-fed floating point
<iximeow> it's time to take the floating point out back
<iximeow> !wpn floating point
* Qboid gives floating point a bifurcation
<bofh> ~*~ RTing catgirls on main ~*~
<egg> whitequark: in the beginning there was Kerbin, and Kerbin did not rotate, and there was only one vessel at a time, and the dark side of Kerbin was explosive on landing. And in that time HarvesteR noticed that the distances from the centre of Kerbin were too great for Unity's single-precision floating point to handle, and HarvesteR did implement some sort of jumpy offset that the physics engine be dealing only with nearby
<whitequark> explosive on landing?!
<iximeow> lmao
<egg> yes there was a bug wherein your rocket blew up if you landed on the dark side
<iximeow> amazing
<whitequark> why
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<egg> who knows
<iximeow> clipping through the planet?
<egg> KSP works in mysterious ways
<egg> (there was a dark side, for Kerbin did not rotate)
<bofh> egg: rofl doing orbital mechanics in single-precision only sounds like a goddamn nightmare.
<egg> bofh: but in that time there were no orbital mechanics
<egg> it was the time before timewarp
<egg> the time before map view
<egg> the time when to check that you were in orbit you had tea while waiting for the next apsis
<egg> bofh: there was only Euler and the point mass of Kerbin
<egg> and in that time there were those who built giant rockets to reach escape velocity and disappear into the formless void (for there were no other bodies and the sun was but a lens flare in the celestial sphere which is made of crystal)
<egg> and those who did reach high velocities had their rockets shake themselves into disintegration
<egg> and they did call it the kraken, for it devoured the vessels that ventured into deep space
<SnoopJeDi> <@bofh> ~*~ RTing catgirls on main ~*~
<SnoopJeDi> extremely bofh
<SnoopJeDi> even without context
<bofh> egg: augh
<egg> and in 0.12 the Mun was added, and NovaSilisko did go there without timewarp and livestreamed it
<egg> wait no, time warp was added before the mun?
<iximeow> egg: did Kerbin yet rotate?
<egg> iximeow: in 0.12 too I think
<egg> bofh: whitequark: and the players did have a reason to go to high velocities to visit the Mun, and many were lost to the deep space kraken
<egg> (though the sun was still a lens flare on the celestial sphere, so heliocentric velocities were not yet an issue)
<egg> wait was it?
<kmath> <✔planet4589> The tension mounts: Has Schiaparelli fallen victim to the Great Galactic Ghoul, Mars-probe predator since the 1960s? https://t.co/rMIXF934WT
<SnoopJeDi> oh neat, html5lib broke through the asymptotic 1.0 barrier
<egg> bofh: whitequark: nevermind, in .12 the sun *was* massive and at a finite distance
<SnoopJeDi> v0.999999999 is so so *so* stupid
<egg> (but it was still a lens flare)
<bofh> rofl
<egg> and so while those who went to the Mun were relatively fine, those who dared escape into heliocentric orbits were ruthlessly devoured for their speed was great and precision was single
<egg> but there was no good reason to leave the Kerbin-Mun system, so this was not too bad
<egg> eventually in 0.17 the Krakensbane was added, banishing the Kraken
<egg> it offsets the velocity of everything (but continuously, rather than stepwise like the floating origin) so that unity sees only smol speeds
<egg> and their was much rejoicing, for in that time the other planets were added, and the banishment of the kraken made it possible to visit them
<SnoopJeDi> continuously?
<SnoopJeDi> reminds me vaguely of the physics grid stuff in Star Citizen (planet-to-space precision issues wheeee)
<egg> yes, at every frame the speed of the krakensbane changes
<egg> whereas the floating origin doesn't move all the time if you don't move very fast
<SnoopJeDi> ahh, okay, as-frequent-as-you-can updates vs. occasionally looking to see if it should be changed?
<whitequark> unity seems like kinda shit
<SnoopJeDi> it's kinda really shit
<SnoopJeDi> but so was BUILD :P
<whitequark> BuiLD?
<whitequark> *BUILD?
<egg> SnoopJeDi: yes, keeping the vessel at 0 speed (for some definition of the vessel) rather than nudging it close on occasion
<SnoopJeDi> the duke3d engine
<SnoopJeDi> just being a prat and pointing out that game engines are $100% always bad from some perspective, you just make them less bad in the ways you care most about
<egg> whitequark: and this is why there is a dead kraken on pol
<SnoopJeDi> in Unity's case being able to to drop-in-drop-out development has been really disruptive and their ideas about licensing are cool too, but it might be reaching the end of its lifecycle?
<bofh> egg: ohh I always wondered about that.
<egg> whitequark: bofh: nevermind, the version history page tells me that in the first released version (I only played the 2nd, not the first) there was no floating origin
<SnoopJeDi> UE4 certainly seems to be cleaning their goddamned clock
<egg> (so intercontinental kraken)
<SnoopJeDi> but UE4 has grossness too? visual programming
<SnoopJeDi> egg, written history of KSP from a numerics perspective? :D
<egg> !wpn whitequark, котя, and the котяchrome kitten
* Qboid gives whitequark, котя, and the котяchrome kitten a catadioptric attribute
<egg> (or should that be коте)
<whitequark> y
<egg> whitequark: Unity has a lot of weirdness, but it's nothing compared to the cathedral of madness that KSP builds atop it
<SnoopJeDi> it's a minor miracle that KSP holds together in the slightest
<SnoopJeDi> afaict
<egg> the reference frames of the Orbit class that are left handed for half the functions and right handed for the other always amaze me
<egg> also the ladder force
<egg> I think you can't beat the absurdity of the ladder force
<SnoopJeDi> egg, I'm unfamiliar, please elaborate a bit?
<kmath> <eggleroy> Bug #1415: Kerbals holding ladders are immune to gravity, the ladder itself imbues them with weight. KSP is strange. https://t.co/AD3ma7om4s
<Qboid> [#1415] title: Vessel relative velocities change when switching to EVA | Park 2 vessels close to each other with as less relative speed as possible. Perform EVA from anyone of the vessels. The other vessel starts moving away with relative speed of about 2-3 m/s (as reported by the target frame navball.) Attaching a save file where this can be immediately verified.... | https://github.com/moc
<Qboid> kingbirdnest/principia/issues/1415
<SnoopJeDi> ...huh.
<SnoopJeDi> is there...any reason to not have the body whose SOI you're in doing that?
<egg> KSP
<egg> I'm sure at some point it fixed a stupid bug in the stupidest possible way
<SnoopJeDi> I mean when you're IVA it makes plenty of sense to just add the kerbal's weight to the vehicle, and you obviously want to account for that when they go EVA, but...???
<SnoopJeDi> yea, smells like a kludge
<SnoopJeDi> which AIUI is basically 100% of the innards
<SnoopJeDi> the game was originally a marketing shiny, right?
<egg> nah, just a hobby by one of the people in that non-software company
<SnoopJeDi> ah
<SnoopJeDi> found the polygon history overview, will hopefully come back and actually read that Eventually™
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<egg> !wpn bofh, whitequark, et al.
* Qboid gives bofh, whitequark, et al. an Apollonian triangle which vaguely resembles a merge conflict
<bofh> okay a mix of ketotifen eyedrops and 2x cetirizine makes being in the same room as longhaired cats okay for me again
<bofh> I don't know how the heck I developed a cat allergy in my mid-20s but it's annoying.
<egg> bofh: ow
<egg> bofh: also, you are near cats?
<egg> bofh: can we haz catpics
<egg> !u ◲
<Qboid> U+25F2 WHITE SQUARE WITH LOWER RIGHT QUADRANT (◲)
<bofh> egg: I just left but I can ask the party in question for catpics
<egg> bofh: did you manage to pet the cat too
<egg> bofh: also, related to that discussion of irfna as drain cleaner or whatever that was :-p https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QmCdrDLyNXQ
<kmath> YouTube - Making fuming nitric acid
<bofh> LOL
<UmbralRaptor> Allergies seem like a serious problem with being a catgirl/catboy/nyanby.
<egg> bofh: I mean if your pipes are clogged by hydrazine for some reason I guess it works,
<UmbralRaptor> egg: aaaaaa
<bofh> egg: uhm
<SnoopJeDi> man, the photographer snapped some really great images from this year's Festival: https://www.flickr.com/photos/tamuphysics/41341545001/
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<kmath> <whitequark> oxygen is a metal https://t.co/dCD8tQyEVa
<UmbralRaptor> >_> <_<
<egg> Neon too :-p
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