Deddly changed the topic of #KSPOfficial to: Kerbal Space Program official channel | versions: KSP1 1.12.2 http://bit.ly/ksp112update | Rules: http://tinyurl.com/KSP-Rules | "modcall" to call ops | Δv maps: https://i.imgur.com/CHVnEeE.png https://i.imgur.com/gBoLsSt.png | KSP coming to PS5 & XBox X/S, with kb & mouse support https://bit.ly/3Abadja
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<Mat2ch> so cheesy, it smells
<Mat2ch> :D
<Deddly> I feel that the mouseover text has a joke in it that I don't get
<Mat2ch> Has probably something to do with the fact that usually rockets are not recovered and fall into the ocean
<Mat2ch> and for all other questions: https://www.explainxkcd.com/wiki/index.php/Main_Page
<Mat2ch> yes, there is a website that explains xkcd comics. :D
<Deddly> True
<Deddly> Ah OK, now I get it
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<flayer> i'm tired
<darsie> That's not very Kerbal.
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<packbart> there's a mod for that
<Althego> hehe
<Althego> against tiredness in humans, or making kerbals tired?
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* darsie snorted 30 mg caffeine.
<Althego> lol
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* raptop wonders if buying all that coffee yesterday was a good idea
<Althego> just buy the caffeine :)
<darsie> One 100 mg dose is just 0.005 EUR.
<Althego> that is a rounding error. it rounds to 0 with real money :)
<Althego> lol premium
<Althego> also bio
<darsie> :)
<Althego> and vegan
* raptop always finds it surreal that you can just buy chemicals off of sigma-aldritch
<darsie> 100% free of antimatter :)
<raptop> I mean, a lot of things are vegan
<Althego> gluten free
<raptop> on a semi-related note, it was interesting to note that my tortillas advertise themselves as parve and aluminum-free
<darsie> How can I download/display teh origininal pic/size?
<darsie> Ahh, in the menu.
<Althego> must be because of conspiracy theorists
<Althego> at least somehow chemtrails are supposed to be harmful because of Al. never mind yu can find it in the soil
<packbart> citing "In 1965, however, animal experiments suggested a possible connection between aluminium and Alzheimer's disease."
<packbart> I vaguely remember some anti-alumin(i)um hype a few years ago
<darsie> There's a link between aluminium based antiperspirants and breast cancer, even in men.
<darsie> I doubt I could find that documentary again, though.
<packbart> ah, thanks, that was the one I remember
<packbart> so, uhh, Al-free bread is supposedly made from synthetic or purified hydro-cultured grain?
<darsie> Porcelain (/ˈpɔːrsəlɪn/) is a ceramic material made by heating substances, generally including a material like kaolin, ... Kaolinite (/ˈkeɪ.ə.lɪˌnaɪt/ KAY-ə-lih-nyte)[4][5][6] is a clay mineral, with the chemical composition Al2Si2O5(OH)4.
<darsie> We may still have an aluminium based baking sheet.
<raptop> synthetic grain?
* raptop would like to know more
<raptop> unless this means, like, corn
<Althego> hehe kaolinite, a character in sailor moon :)
<Althego> (yes in one part they were named after minerals)
<packbart> raptop: well, growing Al-free wheat in natual soil is pretty difficult, I imagine
<raptop> hm
<raptop> Future headline: "lunar crops heavily contaminated with aluminum"
<packbart> so I'd imagine a sci-fi hydroponics lab with purified water plus precisely produced additives - just no Al compounds
<packbart> or rather I expect the label on the packaging merely meaning "look, transparent plastic packaging. no Al-foil!!"
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<packbart> it's got Enriched Flour but no Electrolytes
<darsie> I'm not offended by a gasproof aluminium middle layer.
<darsie> if it makes sense for the product.
<flayer> damnnnn
<darsie> Damnation (from Latin damnatio) is the concept of divine punishment and torment in an afterlife for actions that were committed, or in some cases, not committed on Earth.
<packbart> don't they puff up during air transport? Füllhöhe produktionsbedingt.
<Mat2ch> !mission
<LunchBot> Mat2ch: You arrive on the Mun, only to discover that Scott Manley has beaten you there. Physics fails you, and you fall through the ceiling.
<Mat2ch> Ah, so KSP.
<Mat2ch> :D
<flayer> i smell so bad
<Mat2ch> The big crane is dissambled in Boca Chica... which means they are done with the launch tower for now.
<darsie> Get some aluminium antiperspirant.
<Mat2ch> I wonder when we will see the chopsticks lift the first time.
<Mat2ch> !mission
<LunchBot> Mat2ch: You must not misrepresent reality, you must be obedient, and you must protect your pilot. You're barred from further flights due to government legislation imposed by a competing space program.
<darsie> Give breast cancer a chance.
<Althego> supposedly at 6:37 local time they moved
<Judge_Dedd> <flayer> i smell so bad <-- sounds like a case of COVID-19
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<flayer> Judge_Dedd, more like a case of not showering for three days
<flayer> but the problem has been addressed!
<Judge_Dedd> Addressed to whom?
<flayer> not sure...
<Judge_Dedd> ;)
<darsie> I don't see anything moving at 6:37 in https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mhJRzQsLZGg
<Althego> i didnt watch it myself
<Althego> zombie, but it is apex, so i dont care
<Althego> phoenix, and it is pumpkin
<Althego> i havent seen anything
<Althego> watch the whole 6:37
<Althego> kikkerikii
<darsie> Are the chopsticks the arms that shall catch SH?
<Althego> i think so
<darsie> I don't see them moving.
<Althego> me neither
<Althego> they moved too slowly
<Mat2ch> they are moving sideways, not up and down
<Mat2ch> go to 6:37 and then start skipping forward
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<Althego> actually better visible in the other view. i was focusing one the top left
<Althego> there it was not so prominent
<Althego> and the skipping jelps
<Althego> hopefully it is going to move faster during catch
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<darsie> You can see it clearly in the top right view if you skip a few minutes forward.
* darsie aims for a double mission: Plant a flag on the Mun and rescue a Kerbal from the surface of the Mun.
<darsie> there
<raptop> Hopefully the Mun will not notice that you've replaced the kerbal with a flag
<darsie> lol, I had a deserted pod 1.3 km away from the new stranded Kerbal. Didn't have to make a low pass over Seanbur to control him.
<raptop> nice
<Althego> what a luck
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<darsie> Hmm, I have a fancy but expensive Munar rescue capsule with a Dawn saved. Shall I use it or make a cheap one?
<darsie> Oops, I forgot the checklist and Jeb sneaked on board.
<darsie> Staging, electric, comms, crew, engineer's report
<Althego> hehe
<darsie> Purged some unused monopropellant, too.
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<SporkWitch> is there a way to calculate lift force on planes? I'm struggling to figure out a way other than just trial and error to figure out how much wing area I need for a given weight, speed, and altitude
<darsie> Seanbur Kerman splashed down near the KSC and swam to shore.
<darsie> Ohh, no, Seanbur forgot to plant a flag on the Mun prior to jetpacking to orbit.
finch is now known as Ariri
<flayer> oops
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<Mat2ch> SporkWitch: afaik there is no way to tell how big your lift aera is, so...
<ChucklesTheBeard> I think FAR used to just show you that, no idea if it still does
<Mat2ch> But FAR also alters the atmosphere
<ChucklesTheBeard> and the rest of the aerodynamics stuff too, yeah
<SporkWitch> been trying to avoid mods :( just seems like critical info missing, makes design difficult.
<SporkWitch> Latest design is doing pretty well with a pair of wheezley turbofans, though. Made it about 1/3 around the world and still have about 3/5 of my fuel, though at 12km and just over 2/3 throttle it has to fly at about 18° AoA lol. I might try rotating the wings and offsetting the aelerons, see if that at least lets me fly level lol
<SporkWitch> landing is right off the menu; every landing attempt I've made that would be survivable in a real plane of similar weight and design, the gear instantly explodes
<SporkWitch> ended up cheating and strapping parachutes to it, heh
<SporkWitch> (though i'm assuming it's because i'm stuck with the original fixed landing gear for now; presumably the retractable will have better tolerance, as well as helping my aerodynamics)
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<ChucklesTheBeard> for a long, long time we didn't even get dV displayed in the VAB. KSP's design philosophy was always "no numbers, throw stuff at the wall and see what sticks"
<SporkWitch> that's fine in creative, not so much if doing career :P heh
<ChucklesTheBeard> Bah that's what the revert button's for :D
<SporkWitch> that's why i'm working on the planes, it seems like the cheapest and best way to get a lot of money and science early on, with all the survey contracts
<SporkWitch> granted, heh, but i'm a planner lol
<SporkWitch> current build is doing pretty well, though, just over an hour of flight time and still over half fuel
<SporkWitch> should be a profitable flight, too; three survey locations nearby each other
<SporkWitch> need upgrades for the high altitude surveys, though; either that or use an orbiter and do an orbital survey, if it'll count that
<ChucklesTheBeard> the most kerbal upgrade: strap on an extra SRB
<SporkWitch> i do have ONE more part allowed, so i might consider it if i can't find enough money to upgrade the SPH lol
<SporkWitch> that initial 30 part limit makes things TIGHT lol
<ChucklesTheBeard> You've heard of RATO (Rocket Assisted Take Off)... Coming soon to a runway near you: RAZC (Rocket Assisted Zoom Climb) :D
<SporkWitch> i may need to look into the mods that allow recovery of separated parts, becuase that would really open up creative launch solutions.
<ChucklesTheBeard> stagerecovery is the one I use for that, it's even more rough on the part count though since you need a parachute on the jettisoned stages
<SporkWitch> according to the wiki, even the kickback SRB that says it's recoverable doesn't actually work out because of its low impact tolerance
<SporkWitch> that's reasonable though, since if it was magic that'd just be cheaty
<SporkWitch> related to that: is there any way to clear debris on the ground? I had a test after splashdown, and that debris marker is annoying me lol
<ChucklesTheBeard> yeah hover over it and hit recover, I think you can do that from the KSC "menu" screen
<ChucklesTheBeard> also from the tracking station
<ChucklesTheBeard> you can also just make more debris elsewhere, the game will delete anything over 250 pieces by default :)
<SporkWitch> heh
<SporkWitch> i'm not RealCivilEngineer, i try NOT to make everything explode :P
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<SporkWitch> ah, debris is disabled by default, that's why i couldn't figure out how to pick it up lol
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<darsie> After upgrade in the orbital lab Seanbur could deploy his chute and landed without falling over.
<FLHerne> You can do even the 'above 19.5km' one with Wheesleys in a zoom-climb
<SporkWitch> radio follows LoS correctly, right? So it would make sense for me to send a commsat to Mun in a polar orbit (to relay signals from the far side)?
<FLHerne> When I first played with planes I built one with a LV-T30 centre engine (hadn't researched Terrier) for those, but it isn't necessary
<FLHerne> Yes
<SporkWitch> the last time i played was well before 1.0; the amount that's changed and been added is spectacular lol
<SporkWitch> and it's only getting me more hyped for KSP2; that was resumed, right? I desperately want to build up off-world bases and actual orbital construction
<FLHerne> KSP 2 is coming
<FLHerne> At least we have ISRU now
<SporkWitch> i never really modded much, though I'm tempted to use mechjeb just for getting to orbit out of convenience
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<FLHerne> which creates a reason to build mining bases and orbital fuel stations, and generally makes non-Kerbin-centric operations much more practical
<SporkWitch> i'll have to check it out; any issues modding the linux version? everything still fully compatible?
<FLHerne> proper orbit won't work for "above x", but I think 69.9km or so is fine
<JVFoxy> FLHerne could do with two in two different polar orbits because at some point, in the orbit, the relay sats will end behind
<FLHerne> Linux is moddable fine
<FLHerne> Yeah
<FLHerne> There's something on the wiki about optimal comsats
<FLHerne> tbh I usually just make sure I have a pilot :p
<SporkWitch> used to do radio and satcom in the USAF, so always fun when things actually get it right :P
<JVFoxy> oh sorry SporkWitch. although.. I thought about one of the fake lagrange points.. outside of
<JVFoxy> mun's SOI.. but matching Muns exact orbit
<Rokker> SporkWitch: USAF ping
<SporkWitch> lol
<Rokker> you ever been to my museum?
<Rokker> or at least W0AFB
<Rokker> WPAFB
<JVFoxy> I haven't gone out and pulled down AM-HAMsat signals in a while.. a little sad the Fox project sats aren't doing so well these days
<SporkWitch> only aereospace museum i remember going to was the one just off-base when I was stationed in Warner Robins.
<Rokker> ew
<Rokker> lol
<Rokker> Warner Robin's planes are in sad shape at that museum
<Rokker> I work at the National Museum of the USAF at WPAFB
<SporkWitch> you're not wrong, but hey, worse places to be stationed. Could've been Minot
<SporkWitch> (though even Minot would probably be better than commiefornia...)
<Rokker> Well if you are ever nearby, it's worth a stop in Dayton. we don't have a ton of commsat stuff but we have a ton of space stuff
<SporkWitch> now i'm curious if KSP2 will do 3-body, instead of single SoI
<SporkWitch> (re: JVFoxy's comment about fake lagrange points)
<SporkWitch> I've got a Ryzen 9 3950x in here, i think i should be able to handle the orbital maths
<FLHerne> I really doubt it
<Rokker> principa
<Rokker> is always hit or miss
<Rokker> for me at least
<FLHerne> It's not just computationally expensive, it makes the game a lot trickier especially for new players
<FLHerne> means you can't really have stable orbits anywhere without station-keeping
<FLHerne> I suppose they could add auto-station-keeping
<SporkWitch> true...
<FLHerne> but like proper Mach effects, it's the kind of unintuitive detail they can leave to the modders
<SporkWitch> i just want landing gear that can handle actual landing stresses lol. I play a lot of DCS, and the first set of fixed landing gear explodes if you breath on it funny lol
<FLHerne> (with KSP 1 you can use Principia and FAR, I'm sure KSP 2 will get the same)
<SporkWitch> Even cheating using parachutes, i still tend to lose at least one wheel on landing lol
<FLHerne> Yeah, those ones are a bit unforgiving
<FLHerne> there's a knack to it
<Rokker> look at that big boy in the back there
<FLHerne> Increasing braking force on the rear wheels helps a bit IME
<SporkWitch> that seems totally unrelated, FLHerne lo
<SporkWitch> *lol
<SporkWitch> Rokker: i see that; shiny ^^
<FLHerne> and really flare just before touchdown to land as slowly and horizontally as possible
<FLHerne> well, they often don't explode the instant you touch down, but when you hit some tiny terrain bump
<SporkWitch> I've been thinking of trying a helicopter; suck with them in DCS, but I feel like the slightly wonky aerodynamic physics in KSP would be more forgiving (nor VRS to worry about)
<FLHerne> so decelerating ASAP helps
<Rokker> SporkWitch: anything specific you work with like AEHF or Milstar?
<JVFoxy> remember when terrain quality used to really cause problems with landing and sudden disassembly...
<FLHerne> If you dial up nose braking it tends to ground-loop, so that doesn't work so well
<Rokker> oh shoot
<JVFoxy> lol.. nose brakes aren't usually a thing in planes if I recal
<Rokker> I forgot to link some pictures to yall
<SporkWitch> Rokker: most had worked with vehicle-mount or towed setups. Warner Robins was a Combat Comm unit, so we focused on bare base setups right after the marines or army cleared it out.
<SporkWitch> Rokker: also worked with INMARSAT and BGAN units, though i've always worked on MILSTAR
<JVFoxy> someone having problems with the tier landing wheels I take it?
<SporkWitch> s/always/also/
<Rokker> gotcha
<SporkWitch> JVFoxy: yeah, why i just cheated and slapped some chutes equidistant from the center of mass lol
<SporkWitch> basically just gave up on them and figure i'll fight harder once i can afford to unlock the retractable gear
<SporkWitch> just put a probe in orbit, about to try for a mun burn, which should give some nice science and a payout for the flyby
<JVFoxy> if you can, sometimes adding a second set of first tier main landing wheels with the first ones helps with the load.. old days, it used to be they'd hit the ground, drag for a split second and blow up regardless of how softly your vertical was
<Rokker> about wants to play a game of guess the cockpit
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<JVFoxy> oh?
<JVFoxy> I've managed to dig up some old pc archives... think I got a few cockpit pics somewhere..
<SporkWitch> definitely 2nd gen, not sure exactly what though. probably mechanical flight controls or lower speed, or the stick would be to the right side
<Rokker> lemme re-upload in higher quality
<JVFoxy> interesting stick on the far left. I seem to notice lack of throttle handles.. unless they small
<Rokker> JVFoxy: they're small
<JVFoxy> I see it.. single engine
<JVFoxy> wait.. why's there heavy water warning lights?
<Rokker> SporkWitch: not a fighter. fighters have to chase this thing
<SporkWitch> yeah, centre stick implied that. What is it using hydrogen peroxide for? lol (i see that indicator marked H202 Hot)
<JVFoxy> also dump
<JVFoxy> and camera controls
<JVFoxy> heh.. reads up to 800knots.. though could just be stock IAS indicator
<Rokker> definitely goes faster
<Rokker> but they start using inertial indicators at that point
<JVFoxy> oh wait... x-15
<JVFoxy> you missing the handle on the far left control for the RCS
<Rokker> yep
<JVFoxy> noticed stick on the right though too
<Rokker> opened her up a few weeks back for open cockpit day
<Rokker> tool time off lunch to go check it out
<Rokker> took
<SporkWitch> oof, just noticed how screwed up my initial orbit burn was; almost 18° inclination relative to the mun lol
<Rokker> less cool and less well known but underappreciated and awesome
<darsie> SporkWitch: H202 is unstable. Try H198.
<JVFoxy> oooh right side stick was duplicate of center stick in case of high gees made it hard
<Rokker> JVFoxy: where'd you read that?
<JVFoxy> Rokker was going to say, if anyone else is curious about x-15 cockpit: https://www.sierrafoot.org/x-15/pirep2.html
<SporkWitch> darsie: i'm just going by what's in the pic
<JVFoxy> Rokker: there is this line on the page: First, there's a conventional center stick and rudder pedals. There's also a console stick at your right hand for use when G loads make it difficult to use the center stick. Both are mechanically coupled together and to a system of bell cranks that sum their inputs with those from the Stability Augmentation S
<JVFoxy> ystem (SAS).
<Rokker> oh yoy meant the right stick. I was about to say, left stick is for RCS
<Rokker> I forgot the right stick
<JVFoxy> ya I mentioned the left control thing.. seemed odd at first. Then saw another pic, said it was missing the handle portion
<Rokker> anyways. wanna take a stab at the second cockpit?
<darsie> SporkWitch: Siriusly, it's H2O2, not H202.
<darsie> Which pic?
<SporkWitch> second or third rokker linked; as far as i could see it read H2O2
<JVFoxy> Rokker: well we on a theme? I'mma say the X-1?
<JVFoxy> er wait.. hold up
<Rokker> you're on the right track
<JVFoxy> x-1 was from side/bottom.. not top
<darsie> ok
<JVFoxy> oh.. derp, X-1B
<Rokker> ye
<JVFoxy> d'nt know much about the other variants truth be told
<JVFoxy> what was the reasoning behind the lower door on the original -1?
<Rokker> slimmest design possible I'd imagine
<JVFoxy> not even an ejector seat I'm reading
<JVFoxy> so guessing they figured didn't have to worry about canopy access
<JVFoxy> ponder if I can do a dual mission, one to minmus (robotic two part lander) , another to mun, crewed but with a station
<Rokker> JVFoxy: well this was 1946-47, the first successful Martin Baker ejection seat test was July 1946 and took place in a plane with much higher weight margins and lower speeds.
<Rokker> not surprising it didn't have an ejection seat