Probus has joined #RO
BadInternetCo has quit [Ping timeout: 207 seconds]
probus_ has quit [Ping timeout: 198 seconds]
probus_ has joined #RO
Probus has quit [Ping timeout: 182 seconds]
BadInternetCo has joined #RO
CommandoDiamond has joined #RO
BadRocketsCo has quit [Ping timeout: 198 seconds]
<lamont> wow i broke something weird
Senshi has quit [Quit: Leaving.]
<lamont> oh geeze i just need more coffee
<Bornholio> starwaster whats the status on Newcryo Rf
Wetmelon has joined #RO
Moistmelon has quit [Ping timeout: 186 seconds]
<Starwaster> lamont: it is a known fact that coders convert caffeine directly into code. If you haven't consumed coffee then you are drawing on your fat reserves and muscle which do NOT convert to very high quality code
<Starwaster> KNOWN. FACT. (oid)
<Starwaster> bornholio slow
<lamont> yep, agreed
<Bornholio> is working code?
<Bornholio> should test?
<Bornholio> Elseif Stay RFmaster
* soundnfury gives Starwaster a comathematician
SpecimenSpiff has joined #RO
BadRocketsCo has joined #RO
awang has quit [Ping timeout: 383 seconds]
BadInternetCo has quit [Ping timeout: 383 seconds]
<NathanKell|AFK> Psa no stream tonight, I'll be out
<Bornholio> party on Nathan :)
awang has joined #RO
<NathanKell|AFK> It *is* my birthday, so yes :)
<probus_> Happy Birthday!!
probus_ is now known as Probus
<UmbralRaptor> NathanKell|AFK.uptime++
<Bornholio> .execute_BIG part.y.exe
<Bornholio> don't worry no viruses
<Bornholio> https://imgur.com/gallery/yyeE6 pretty sure FAR won't let me do this
<SpecimenSpiff> Happy birthday Nathan!
<SpecimenSpiff> With that fighter, I'm less impressed with the thrust and vectoring than that the engines didnt flame out
<Bornholio> but the wings didn't rip off
<Bornholio> far likes to rip my wings off when i make them do that
SpecimenSpiff has quit [Quit: Web client closed]
<Starwaster> bornholio that's because you need to see FAR for what it really is, a sick demented little boy who likes to pull the wings off of flies. YOU are the fly. Have fun.
<Starwaster> Bornholio: Here's a link to the RF dll. There might be other stuff on the other branches that's not in this but that's got the MLI. Add layers by using the slider on the part context menu. (ignore the ones that say insulation or insulation type - they don't do anything): https://www.dropbox.com/s/jw27k5004rxpih3/RealFuels.dll?dl=1
<Bornholio> use with master or newCryo?
<Bornholio> .bigThanks
<lamont> ^ hopefully that makes NRE spam go away
<Bornholio> .cheer
<awang> Good news: KRASH now successfully finds the RP-0 dll and binds methods to compensate for tooling
<awang> Bad news: KRASH doesn't actually compensate for tooling
<Starwaster> bornholio should be ok to just throw the plugin in with the new one. btw, caveats: MLI doesn't have extra cost or mass (YET) and it should NOT be exposed to high temperatures like ascent or reentry
<Starwaster> if you do the part will likely explode. Protect it with a fairing on ascent
<Bornholio> hmm
<Starwaster> that issue will be addressed... probably by destroying the MLI when the skin overheats. What happens is that because it's a poor thermal conductor, heat builds up on the exterior. Causing it to go all explodey-wodey
Vader111 has joined #RO
<Starwaster> so probably best thing is for it to melt or something and cause the skin to revert to its normal conductivity. Probably just layer by layer until a stable situation is reached
<Starwaster> in fact it's probably just two lines of code....
<Bornholio> doesn't sound like real mli then
<Starwaster> because it doesnt melt?
<Bornholio> not like its parafin that melts off
<Bornholio> if it came off it was almost catastrophic and due to aero
<Starwaster> one catastrophe at a time please
<Bornholio> regardless noted, will fairing
<Vader111> Happy Hatching
<Vader111> Day Nathan
<Starwaster> lamont, please persist PEG data per saved MJ vessel data? (things like pitch program... and other PEG parameters that the player might change)
<lamont> hmmmmm i thought it did
<Vader111> so it isn't just me going mad
<lamont> pretty sure i changed that for NK a long time ago
<Starwaster> no.... err I'm not on #12... maybe you did it for one of the recent builds? All I know is right now it's not persisting
BadRocketsCo has quit [Ping timeout: 207 seconds]
<lamont> yeah its alll Pass.Type | Pass.Global
<lamont> i changed that ages ago during NKs 1.2.2 twitch stuff
<lamont> is it something specific not persisting? the boolean toggles aren’t using EditableWhatever objects and are just true/false
<lamont> is there an EditableBoolean...
<Starwaster> pitch rate, pitch end... I changed those last launch and that was a totally differently named rocket
<Starwaster> start PEG after
<Starwaster> wait... global?
<lamont> i /think/ the way that works is new rockets get the same setting as your last rocket, but rockets of different existing types don’t overwrite each other
<lamont> (new rocket types)
<lamont> so if you’re interating on a launch vehicle each new type will start with whatever you were playing with last, but if you go back to an old type you get the same settings…
<lamont> i think..
<lamont> maybe…
<Starwaster> lamont these are all existing designs not new designs
<Starwaster> one of them needs a high pitch rate of 0.7 and the other 0.545 but I have to change them each time that I use a different rocket
<awang> Anyone see anything like this?
<Starwaster> I dont think you want Pass.Global
<lamont> there is barely any use of Pass.Type without Pass.Global in the existing codebase
<Starwaster> awang... lolwhut? How did you do that
<Starwaster> lamont ok I'll just live with it I guess
<lamont> well i agree it shouldn’t work that way, i’m just confused
<lamont> pretty sure the Global was there because NK hated seeing the hardcoded defaults on new designs, but it shouldn’t be stomping over types it already knows about
<awang> Starwaster: I have no idea
<awang> I've had two of them for a while now
<Starwaster> ok it's like this... I have a design I use a LOT. Typically just to 190km for short tourist hops. I know what parameters it needs. I haven't used it in awhile and I loaded it in a few minutes ago and its parameters were the same as the previous rocket that I had launched, which had a totally different set of params.... non circular orbit of 400-190. That carried over to the design that has always jsut been 190
<awang> Got three all of a sudden
<awang> No idea what KSP is doing
<Starwaster> awang well the more the merrier. More is better right? MOAR????
<Starwaster> MOAR MENUZ!!!
<Starwaster> GIMME ALL TEH MENUZ
<awang> The thing is I have my install in git
<awang> So in theory it should reset to the same state every time
<awang> Evidently something even funkier is going on
qwertyy__ has joined #RO
qwertyy_ has quit [Ping timeout: 186 seconds]
<lamont> Starwaster: maybe updating the code invalidates the old params?
<lamont> so the apo and periapsis are global-only
<lamont> oh actually its not inclination and periapsis are both by type
<lamont> so that’s fixable
<lamont> fixed
<Bornholio> going to the moon https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p5TOLg-9HbY
<Bornholio> I had to remind my guys to bring back spacex swag, got them a tour so they need to bring at least a flamethrower
ProjectThoth has joined #RO
Mike` has quit [Ping timeout: 207 seconds]
blowfish has joined #RO
Mike` has joined #RO
<blowfish> damn, just missed Tricom-1R
<blowfish> looks like the webcast kind of failed anyway
<blowfish> no confirmation on success
<awang> Yeah, stream quality was pretty bad
Wetmelon has quit [Ping timeout: 186 seconds]
<Bornholio> have link?
<awang> !kountdown 22
<Qboid> awang: ID: 22 | Name: TRICOM 1R/SS-520 5号機 | Time: 2018-02-03 05:03:00 | Unixtime: 1517634180 | Left: 0d 0h 16m 37s
<Qboid> awang: Description: The SS-520 5号機 will launch the 3U cubesat TRICOM 1R (http://space.skyrocket.de/doc_sdat/tricom-1.htm) from 内之浦 KS into an eccentric orbit with a 31° inclination. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s5OiWm4Gn7I
CommandoDiamond_ has joined #RO
CommandoDiamond has quit [Ping timeout: 186 seconds]
<awang> Gah
<awang> I can't get KRASH to subtract tooling costs any more :(
<awang> And I have no clue why
<Bornholio> https://i.imgur.com/70uP91q.png 1500km, struggle bus I
<blowfish> what's the upper stage?
<Bornholio> just xasr's
<awang> That looks... fragile
<Bornholio> shatters into 5 peices
<awang> ....So much temptation to LINQ
<awang> Bornholio: As in actually shatters into 5 pieces?
<Bornholio> garbage to add?
<awang> I guess KJR is too good at what it does :P
<Bornholio> yes, 2 side boosters, then 1st then second :P
<awang> But it's *functional*
<awang> That's a very undramatic version of "shatters"
<awang> Also, found why KRASH wasn't subtracting tooling costs
<awang> Missed a !
<Bornholio> your did not
<Bornholio> you
<Bornholio> hey it shatters very pretty when engines fail
<awang> That would be FAR doing its job?
<Bornholio> farly spectacular
<awang> taniwha: You on?
<taniwha> yeah
<awang> Mind doing another code review?
<taniwha> I don't mind. got it handy?
<Qboid> [69dc2] title: Compensate for tooling... by Alex Wang | Additions: 57 | Deletions: 0 | https://github.com/aw1621107/KRASH/commit/69dc26e67d35a589d927c102651cd8510aa23311
<awang> I'll be force pushing with a more detailed commit message eventually
<awang> Likely later today, since it's getting quite late
<taniwha> force-pushing is really best avoided
<awang> Right, but I'm not expecting anyone to be pulling this
<awang> It's just to get the code up for you to look at while I work on a better commit message
<taniwha> anyway, just what do you need me to look at? (ie, specific bits)
<awang> I guess a general sanity check?
<awang> That's probably quite a lot, though
<taniwha> I'm not sure what happens with CreateDelegate when methodinfo is null
<taniwha> it might be best to check methodinfo before creating the delegate
<awang> You get an ArgumentNullException
<awang> I had that in there, but I figured the RP-0 API would be pretty stable
<taniwha> do you want the exception when passed a type that is missing the method?
<taniwha> ie, do you want to spam errors, or do you want to carry on?
<awang> Carrying on would be ideal
<taniwha> (I'm all for allowing exception spam when exceptions simply should not happen)
<awang> Yeah, I guess I'll add the warnings back in
<awang> Don't think assuming RP-0 will have a stable API is the best idea
<awang> I'm actually not sure if exceptions will prevent KRASH from loading at all
<awang> Since the exceptions would be thrown in the static constructor
<blowfish> awang: linq is ok as long as you're not doing it every frame
<taniwha> exceptions wreak havoc, so if you need to carry on when methods are missing, then you need to do something appropriate
<awang> blowfish: I think it'll be run every frame
<awang> Or at least quite frequently, since it's in a GUI method
<blowfish> ah hmm
<awang> taniwha: Yeah, you're right
<awang> I'll add those checks back in
<blowfish> well, one thing to note is that the allocation associated with linq is in constructing the enumerators, not evaluating them
<blowfish> (usually)
<taniwha> awang: otherwise, nothing leaps out at me
<blowfish> so if you can pre-construct and run multiple times, you are probably not allocating at all
<taniwha> if KRASH isn't working, that will need further investigation on your part (lots of Debug.LogFormat etc)
<awang> blowfish: Hmmm... The only allocation I can think of is getting a List from Part.FindModulesImplementing
<blowfish> yeah well that allocates an actual list
<blowfish> which is bad ... you might as well use Linq
<awang> The rest is just a filter + accumulate
qwertyy has joined #RO
<awang> taniwha: Design looks sane to you?
<taniwha> awang: yeah, design seems quite sane
<awang> taniwha: KRASH uses its own debug calls, which only work in a debug build, unfortunately
<awang> taniwha: Awesome!
qwertyy__ has quit [Ping timeout: 207 seconds]
Vader111 has quit [Ping timeout: 198 seconds]
<awang> blowfish: It's bad, but I should use Linq?
<awang> Oh wait
<awang> You're saying iterate over all modules, since that shouldn't allocate a list?
<awang> Maybe?
<blowfish> well depends
<blowfish> are you getting the list once and saving it, or doing it multiple times?
<awang> taniwha: Thanks for your help!
<awang> blowfish: Multiple times, I think?
<taniwha> awang: you're welcome :)
<awang> Have to grab a specific module from each part in the vessel
<blowfish> then it will allocate a new list every time you call it
<awang> So I guess the question is is the allocation going to hurt more, or will the type check hurt more?
<awang> i.e. if (module is ModuleTooling mt)
<blowfish> if you straight up replaced it with linq, it would allocate an enumerator every time, which would probably be about the same
<blowfish> if you want to avoid allocation, there are two ways
<awang> At least from what I see, it's either allocate a List<T> with FindModulesImplementing or iterate over Part.Modules, which is a PartModuleList
<blowfish> 1) actually iterate over everything in loops and check for the things you want
<awang> And idk if that allocates
<awang> Since it's a property
<blowfish> 2) use linq, but save the enumerator and reuse it
<blowfish> let me check on part.Modules
<awang> Hmmm
<awang> Saving the enumerator might be awkward
<awang> Since I'd have to add some kind of cache
<awang> Don't think there's any similar mechanism present
<awang> You can't add/remove modules after loading, right?
<blowfish> you don't typically
<blowfish> I'm not sure it's guaranteed though
<awang> Does IEnumerator invalidation exist?
<blowfish> okay, as far as PartModuleList goes, foreach will allocate an enumerator but for (int i = 0; i < part.Modules.Count; i++) will not
<blowfish> (this ends up being a very specific thing about how the enumerator is implemented)
<awang> Is allocating an enumerator cheaper than (module is Module) checks?
<blowfish> cheaper in what way?
<awang> Uh
<blowfish> x is Y does not allocate any memory
<blowfish> if that's what your asking
<awang> Right, but idk how computationally expensive it is
<awang> CPU time vs GC pressure
<blowfish> I really don't know, but I've heard that branching doesn't really cost that much in C#
<blowfish> and something has to do the check either way, right?
<awang> I guess?
<awang> Hm
<awang> I'll see about switching to the long for loop at least
<awang> part.Modules returns a reference to the part's module list? Not a copy?
CommandoDiamond_ has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
<blowfish> correct
<awang> Alright
<blowfish> just as an example, if you wanted to store the enumerator you could do somthing like this:
<awang> So swap out the foreach
<awang> Don't use FindModulesImplementing
<awang> Just wondering, would worrying about garbage be that important if sgen were the GC?
<blowfish> IEnumerable<ModuleTooling> modulesOnVessel = vessel.parts.SelectMany(p => p.Modules).OfType<ModuleTooling>();
<blowfish> then later, multiple times
<blowfish> foreach (ModuleTooling module in modulesOnVessel) {}
<blowfish> don't know much about sgen, my guess is it would still matter but not as much
<awang> Hmmm
<awang> Figuring out how to get the right handle for OfType might be interesting
<awang> Since I can't reference ModuleTooling directly
<blowfish> oh
<blowfish> err, do you have a reference to the type?
<awang> Yeah, I got a Type object
<awang> So I can MakeGenericMethod something or another
<blowfish> you can use GetType() then
<blowfish> IEnumerable<ModuleTooling> modulesOnVessel = vessel.parts.SelectMany(p => p.Modules).Where(m => m.GetType() == moduleToolingType);
<awang> Does GetType() take inheritance into account?
<awang> Like would that work for classes that derive from ModuleTooling?
<blowfish> no, but you could handle that using IsAssignableFrom
<awang> Is IsAssignableFrom expensive?
<awang> Expensive like MethodInfo.Invoke?
<blowfish> IEnumerable<ModuleTooling> modulesOnVessel = vessel.parts.SelectMany(p => p.Modules).Where(m => moduleToolingType.IsAssignableFrom(m.GetType()));
<awang> IsAssignableFrom or IsInstanceOfType, I guess
<blowfish> not sure, but I doubt it
<blowfish> IsInstanceOfType also works
<blowfish> I guess that would look like
<blowfish> IEnumerable<ModuleTooling> modulesOnVessel = vessel.parts.SelectMany(p => p.Modules).Where(m => moduleToolingType.IsInstanceOfType(m));
<awang> Would the lambda capture cause allocation?
<awang> Although I guess it's just something you'd pay once
<blowfish> once yes, but not every time it's evaluated
<awang> Hmmm
<awang> Caching should work per-part, as long as modules aren't added/remove after loading
<awang> Per-vessel probably won't, since this calculation might be run at any point in the editor
<awang> Actually...
<awang> Does reloading MM using the F11 menu (or whatever it is) reload modules?
<awang> That might mess with caching
<awang> Although I wouldn't expect most people to be doing that
<blowfish> it re-compiles every part prefab from its config
<blowfish> there will be no instantiated parts active at that point in time, only the prefabs
<awang> Can the MM cache be reloaded while in the editor?
<blowfish> no
<blowfish> only main menu and space center
<awang> Alright, so as long as the cache is only created when entering the editor scene
<blowfish> yes, but remember that you only have the part prefabs at that point
<blowfish> once you start placing parts in the editor they will be different instances
<awang> Hmmm
<awang> I'll have to chew on that some more
<awang> My brain is fried, unfortunately
<awang> So I'm off to bed
<awang> Sorry :(
<awang> Thanks for your help, though!
<awang> Really appreciate it
<blowfish> any time!
<blowfish> awang: actually I was wrong, Where does allocate every time you evaluate it
<blowfish> (reading through the .NET reference source)
<blowfish> seems to be some shenanegans to support threading
BadRocketsCo has joined #RO
Senshi has joined #RO
ProjectThoth has quit [Quit: +++out of cheese error+++]
<blowfish> awang: actually wait, that code is present in compiler-generated iterators too
<blowfish> so disregard what I said about storing the enumerator, it doesn't actually prevent allocations
<blowfish> or at least not all allocations
<blowfish> awang: another option is to use Slinq, which is a zero-allocation alternative to linq
blowfish has quit [Quit: Leaving]
Wetmelon has joined #RO
Hypergolic_Skunk has joined #RO
Vader111 has joined #RO
TM1978m has joined #RO
BadRocketsCo has quit [Ping timeout: 383 seconds]
TM1978m has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
BadRocketsCo has joined #RO
Maxsimal has joined #RO
<Maxsimal> o/
<Maxsimal> Whatever you do guys, don't get this flu
<Starwaster> too late
<Starwaster> try warning me earlier!
<Starwaster> *cough* *cough* *hack* *wheeeeeze*
<Starwaster> ok just coughing..... pretty much over it already
TM1978m has joined #RO
<Probus> Sorry Maxsimal. That sucks.
BadRocketsCo has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
BadRocketsCo has joined #RO
BadRocketsCo2 has joined #RO
BadRocketsCo has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
Senshi has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
Hypergolic_Skunk has quit [Quit: Connection closed for inactivity]
<Mike`> awang, lamont, did 3 launches to 26° inc with -4, 0 and 4 deg leading angle into plane, and 0 was best, -4 was worst
BadRocketsCo2 has quit [Ping timeout: 383 seconds]
<Starwaster> Don't nod off with your hands on the pitch/yaw controls during a launch, or you just might wake up to your rocket doing cartwheels
<Starwaster> Errr that didn't happen to me, it happened to a friend
<Starwaster> actually it was't even my friend, it was a friend of a friend
<Bornholio> silly FoF
<Bornholio> Mainttain AoA
<Starwaster> now that we have improved ascent guidance, we need decent descent guidance... (see what I did there?)
<Starwaster> namely controlled descent for gliding vehicles. (i.e. lifting reentries like Apollo or Curiosity)
<Bornholio> I just set +Hvel then switch to surface mode and drive my pitch duringn descent
<Bornholio> during
<Bornholio> you trying to land on the pad with a pod?
<Bornholio> with RO i usually have a couple kilck of error
<Bornholio> kliscks
<Bornholio> bah km
aradapil_ has joined #RO
aradapilot has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
BadRocketsCo has joined #RO
Senshi has joined #RO
petti has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
BadRocketsCo has quit [Ping timeout: 383 seconds]
BadRocketsCo has joined #RO
<Rokker> so
<Rokker> we now have a new world record for smallest launch vehicle as of midnight EST
<Rokker> last night that is
<Rokker> well, 1203
<Rokker> taniwha: how do you feel about the babby japrocket
Senshi has quit [Quit: Leaving.]
<Bornholio> 日本ロケット
<Bornholio> Super Super Go Hyaku Ni Juu Dash Go
<Bornholio> ^ SS 520-5
petti has joined #RO
BadRocketsCo has quit [Ping timeout: 182 seconds]
<Probus> Luv the bobble head Trump :)
Vader111 has quit [Quit: Leaving]
<Bornholio> he's rocking out to google-chan singing
<Probus> My son is minoring in Japanese. I will have to see if he knows what she's saying
<Rokker> I gotta say, the launch sequence of SS-520 is pretty darn RO-esque
<awang> !tell blowfish Slinq looks interesting, I'll check it out!
<Qboid> awang: I'll redirect this as soon as they are around.
<awang> Anyone else here have experience with Slinq?
<awang> Hmmm
<awang> Notifications on vessel change sound like an even better idea
<lamont> Mike: what kind of rocket (how much time to orbit?)
<lamont> Bornholio: what does the red mean on the spreadsheet?
<Bornholio> something like NOT OPTIONAL
<lamont> 'k
<Bornholio> are you building a 1.3.1
<lamont> starting on it
<Bornholio> good luck, took me four tries :P
<Bornholio> last time i loaded small groups of mods
<lamont> so the github urls are just for reference if there’s no comments?
<Bornholio> yes if in the CKAN section
<awang> Do you guys think KRASH sim costs should drop as bits of rocket are unloaded during flight?
<awang> e.g. drop a stage and it gets unloaded
<awang> Or costs increase as you get within physics range of another vessel
stratochief_ has joined #RO
stratochief has quit [Ping timeout: 383 seconds]
stratochief_ is now known as stratochief
VanDisaster has joined #RO
qwertyy_ has joined #RO
qwertyy has quit [Ping timeout: 198 seconds]
probus_ has joined #RO
Probus has quit [Ping timeout: 182 seconds]
probus_ has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
<Bornholio> not sure what in RO/rp-0 makes things stop being symetrically modified when they are symetrical
<Bornholio> but STAHP
<awang> Bornholio: Quick fix: Pick up the modified piece and place it again
<awang> But yes, it's really really annoying otherwise
<Bornholio> yes, but once you made it to pad , no dice
<awang> It's nice for things like RCS, where you may want to have one pair enabled for one direction, but not the other
<awang> Oh, ouch
<awang> Fix it in the VAB, and do some save file editing?
<Bornholio> then that is simple, place it seperate in pairs. linked symetry is critical
<awang> True
<Bornholio> .kicksdirt
<awang> Could get annoying if vertical placement is important
<awang> But linked symmetry is probably more important
<Bornholio> oh and it can cause lockups when you go back to edit it
<awang> Wait what
<awang> That's news
<Bornholio> wel i have a craft with unlinked symetry occasionally when a part is selected it will spam fill the tank and make vaB useless until reloaded
<Bornholio> when
<awang> wat
<Bornholio> i'll try and capture it next time
<Bornholio> not a long wait
ProjectThoth has joined #RO
<Bornholio> if this happens i must rebuild the symetry parts from scratch or they will make VAB useless
<awang> Huh
<awang> What's the rest of the stack trace?
blowfish has joined #RO
<awang> Bornholio: Do you have TweakScale installed?
<Bornholio> yes but not in use on this craft
<blowfish> nice, TRICOM 1R successful
<Qboid> blowfish: awang left a message for you in #RO [03.02.2018 18:11:52]: "Slinq looks interesting, I'll check it out!"
<awang> Bornholio: Interesting
<awang> All the NREs look like they're happening in different mods
<awang> Some in FinePrint, some in FAR, some in KSP UI code
<awang> IVAEVACollapseGroups
<awang> Wait
<awang> Might have been looking at the wrong NREs
<awang> Bornholio: Were you changing a slider on the symmetric parts?
<Bornholio> they are just tanks i removed tank and refilled, but the opposite didn't
<Bornholio> the V-2 tanks
<Bornholio> well off to a party, have fun
<awang> Hmmm
blowfish has quit [Quit: Leaving]
<awang> Jeez, so many NREs
<Bornholio> yeah it explodes
<Bornholio> almost nothing till then
<Bornholio> just a bit of MJ normal peg stuff
Theysen has joined #RO
TM1978m has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
<ProjectThoth> So, rocker-bogie question - if rovers with that suspension type are only supported at one point, how come they don't flop forward or backwards when accelerating/stopping?
<ProjectThoth> Are they really all supported through their center of mass?
<ProjectThoth> Oh, huh, it's the differential.
<awang> !tell blowfish* Is there any disadvantage to Slinq?
<Qboid> awang: I'll redirect this as soon as they are around.
Probus has joined #RO
<Starwaster> Slinqy
probus_ has joined #RO
Probus has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
<Mike`> lamont, 3 stages to orbit in 7min 16 secs: 1st: 2:17 with SLT 1.24, 2nd: 3:07 with TWR 1.14, 3rd 1:52 with TWR 1.58
Theysen has quit [Quit: Leaving]
<awang> Uhhh
<awang> Possible RP-0 bug
<awang> Actually, never mind
<awang> I'm dumb
<lamont> Mike: cool
<Mike`> just answering your question. :)
<Starwaster> awang no
<Starwaster> (no, KRASH sim costs shouldn't drop just because parts of your rocket fall off)
<lamont> useful datum
<lamont> i’m still trying to teach myself proper trajectory optimization so we don’t have to do the repetetive launches…
<Starwaster> what the absolute f***.... PEG suddenly decided (without consulting me BTW) that my rocket needs a bath
<Starwaster> same damned rocket it launched half a dozen times.... something wrong with my payload? Did I load it down with too much?
<Mike`> was it dirty? :D
<lamont> t = 40 seconds and phi = 45?
<lamont> too much payload will do that. at tgo = 40 PEG has to relax the burnout position constraint so desired-position is just set equal to predicted-position. if phi = 45 then you’re still clipping and predicted-position is nowhere near where you want to actually go. at which point shit usually gets funny...
<Starwaster> lamont no, actually it was fluctuating, cycling over and over again
<Starwaster> hell yeah... almost double the payload mass
<lamont> ah discoball
<Starwaster> total dV was still within acceptable limits so I didn't notice the lower stages weren't getting it where it needed to be
<Starwaster> might be at the limit of my current technology
<lamont> yeah that’s like that rocket i asked that question about on the PEGAS thread… the Atlas V HLV i’d put way too much payload on and it was never getting to orbit...
<Starwaster> I think the problem was I threw a couple of extra tons of LOX on there for the space station's life support
<awang> Dangit
<awang> How do I actually create a Slinq stream
<awang> Wait
<awang> I may have found it
probus_ is now known as Probus
<Probus> Oh. PEG is KOS based. I will need to dink with it. I'm sure I can mess it up proper.
<Probus> I've got one that works pretty good already. I will compare the two.
<lamont> there’s an implementation of PEG in kOS which is called PEGAS
<lamont> its different from the implementation that i have in MJ
<soundnfury> lamont: is PEGAS for launching horses?
<lamont> i think so?
<Starwaster> as long as they dont mass too much
<Starwaster> btw, PEG needs better sanity checking prior to launch where it can properly determine whether or not it can get to orbit with the current payload
<Starwaster> and if the payload masses too much it needs to display in flashing LARGE red letters: ARE YOU OUT OF YOUR FUCKING MIND???
<Starwaster> unless of course educational mode is enabled in which case that can be sanitized
<Starwaster> just my two √'s
Senshi has joined #RO