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<Bornholio> https://imgur.com/gallery/zRsBN lego falcon heavy
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<Bornholio> https://imgur.com/gallery/3tH8x lego elon musk
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<awang> That's... surprisingly fitting
<Bornholio> SPAAACE!
<awang> Jeez, that really puts the thinness of F9 into perspective
<awang> Sort of surprised it doesn't wobble like stock rockets
<Bornholio> Well if you want to haul on highways you gotta be skinny
<awang> Yeah
<awang> Still
<Bornholio> so friggin jealous the guys i sent to LA had their tour today at spacex and said a lot of people were hung over :P
<lamont> falcon heavy baby boom at spacex in 9 months…
<Bornholio> Yisss
<Starwaster> another stupid rescue mission... but this time, flashing red strobes SAVES THE DAY
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<soundnfury> hmm, looks like the "disable the Activate Engine button when you get a TF failure" doesn't block an Action Group if you have one hooked up e.g. to ToggleEngine
<soundnfury> http://jttlov.no-ip.org/2crews1ship.png crew handover at space station. Total orbiting mass (Lagrange Station + Hobbes 2 supply ship + 2× Napier spaceplane) = 16,608 kg.
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<awang_> soundnfury: stop breaking TF pls
<awang_> I'll probably have to look to see if there's a better way of doing the disabling
<awang_> Assuming someone else doesn't beat me to it
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<SRBuchanan> Urgh so many different versions of the R-4D to model.
<SRBuchanan> Speaking of, does anyone know why the original Apollo version had latitudinal ridges on the nozzle extension? Are those to aid radiative cooling or are they structural?
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<BadRocketsCo> Howdy
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<Probus> Oh, very cool lamont!
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<taniwha> impressive photography
<taniwha> I found it hard enough to get a nice shot of the lunar eclipse
<Probus> Wow! I just loaded SSTU for the first time. Its like Christmas!
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<Probus> Mike` is the developer for SSTU, right?
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<Rokker> Bornholio: ouch https://streamable.com/tecjw
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<Mike`> Probus: no, i'm just a random SSTU-fanboy. :) The SSTU dev doesn't like RO
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<awang> Mike`: Blasphemy!
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<probus_> :) Does anyone in this chat take responsibility for SSTU?
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<Starwaster> had to throw someone out of a capsule during ascent from almost kilometer up. She lived though
<Starwaster> probus_ why?
<Probus> I am integrating SSTU into ETT.
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<awang> Starwaster: What would make bailing out at 1km safer than staying in the rocket?
<APlayer> Fire. Lots of it, and in places where it's not supposed to be
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<APlayer> Starwaster: Actually, starting at an altitude of 100 or so m, it stops mattering (may as well have been 10 km, either you get incredibly lucky and survive, or you just don't)
<probus_> Why did you toss 'em out Starwaster?
<APlayer> I found it to be a rather survivable scenario to bail out and start using your MMU to slow down as much as possible before hitting the ground, though
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<Starwaster> probus_ it was supposed to be an empty one man capsule to pick up a stranded dude and someone snuck aboadr so I tossed them like salad
<probus_> Oh yeah, I hate when that happens.
<Starwaster> so I was all like... HAY! GET THE EFF OUTTA MY ROCKET YOU LOCHNESS MONSTER!
<Starwaster> oh wait, wrong story
<probus_> :)
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<Pap> probus_: I know a lot about SSTU, I did all the configs for RO 1.2.2
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<Starwaster> oh shit, the runway is level... how the hell did that happen
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<taniwha> Starwaster: 1.3 fix
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<APlayer> Humm, my RealPlume plumes are kind of plump - anyone know a way to make them brighter and longer?
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<awang> APlayer: idk about brighter, but slowing time down makes the plumes longer-ish
<awang> That's because the actual particles travel faster
<awang> Don't think that's what you were looking for :P
<APlayer> I tried to rig up some MM patches, but I horribly failed at that
<APlayer> The configs are kind of vaguely documented and I was confused
<awang> Just looking at the RealPlume configs
<awang> I'd guess tweaking emission would take care of brightness
<awang> Actually, idk
<awang> I'd compare cryogenic-upperlower and kerolox-lower-f1
<awang> Should be a dim and bright plume, respectively
<awang> So differences between the two might be a good place to start
<APlayer> Humm, yes
<APlayer> Let me see
<awang> Hmmm
<awang> There's references to "lifetime" in the SmokeScreen source
<awang> Guessing that would make your pume longer
<awang> Either that or increasing the velocity they leave the nozzle
<lamont> will spacex ever consider a methalox cryogenic upper for the FH?
<awang> APlayer: Alright, so it seems that changing the energy curve will change how long your plume particles live
<APlayer> Currently checking out this
<APlayer> I set it to an extreme *= 20, because I tried this setting once and saw no effect
<APlayer> Perhaps I overlooked it
<awang> SmokeScreen passes something derived from the energy field to the startLifetime parameter of a ParticleSystem.EmitParams()
<awang> idk, I could be reading the code wrong
<awang> Or the code could be going through a different path
<awang> Where are you making your changes?
<APlayer> ModuleManager patches with :FINAL priority
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<awang> Hmmmm
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<awang> I'd say try changing the base RealPlume configs directly first
<awang> Then once you know what changes to make figure out the right MM patch
<APlayer> That's... a lot of work.
<awang> Eh
<awang> Pick an engine, see what RealPlume config it's using
<awang> Just change that config
<APlayer> Might make sense, but let me run this test anyway (KSP already loaded, so)
<awang> It seems most engines use one of the predefined configs in RealPlume/000_Generic_Plumes
<awang> Alright
<awang> Oh, and increasing the allowed number of particles would be an easy way of making your plumes longer
<awang> idk what it'd do performance-wise, though
<awang> emission controls how many particles are emitted per timestep; probably not what you want
<APlayer> It "worked"
<APlayer> It's still rather weird-looking
<awang> Did it?
<awang> That looks rather normal...
<awang> Weird in what way?
<APlayer> Well, dunno
<APlayer> It looks like a glowing stick coming out of the engine
<APlayer> Might of course be an engine plume, but that requires some fantasy :D
<awang> At least at sea level, that means it needs to get somewhat narrower?
<APlayer> Not sure what it lacks, even, but it does not really look like a plume to me
<awang> And/or break apart at the end of the glowy part
<awang> Well
<awang> Assuming it's kerolox
<awang> And going off the FH launch
<awang> It's too uniformly bright
<awang> Too opaque
<APlayer> Yes and yes, probably
<awang> Needs to get narrower after leaving the nozzle
<APlayer> I upped the particle density too, so there's your opacity
<APlayer> Not sure how to make it less even
<awang> And needs to have that... effect... where the tail part of the plume right before it stops glowing blows around wildly
<APlayer> Is this a thing in RealPlume?
<awang> There's a setting for "randConeEmit"
<APlayer> It's blank in the configs you told me to look at
<awang> But for the blowing around wildly, you probably need a lot of fast, short-lived particles with a somewhat large difference in lifetimes
<APlayer> It is there, but neither true nor false, Schroedinger's config
<awang> Basically, RealPlume particles are moving too slowly to faithfully recreate a proper plume
<awang> (in my opinion)
<awang> I'm not sure randConeEmit is the right setting
<awang> Thing is if you bump up the particle velocity, you need more of them to generate a continuous plume
<awang> And that messes with performance
<APlayer> I currently have quite a bit of "excess performance", so I don't mind doing that
<awang> If you want a plume like the shuttle SRBs, you need lots of opaque particles that quickly change from orange-yellow to grey, and have a long lifetime
<awang> And high velocity at first that slows down a lot
<awang> Hydrogen plumes... idk?
<awang> SSME plumes look sort of like stock KSP plumes, now that I think about it
<awang> At least at ground level
<awang> Delta IV ones are sort of like kerolox plumes, but dimmer, redder, and less opaque
<APlayer> Humm, that sounds like I'd need to redo the configs as a whole
<awang> If you have excess performance, try bumping down the speed, decreasing the energy, and increase emission, at least
<awang> If you want all engines to look more real, yeah
<awang> Just specific types? Might be able to get away with just editing the kerolox (or hydrolox or solid or etc.) config
<APlayer> Noone did such a thing before?
<awang> I don't know?
<awang> I'm not sure what exactly what required to create RealPlume in the first place
<awang> Could be that no one has spent the time
<awang> Or the current state is the preferred result
<awang> Or the current state is not perfect, but good enough, due to time/performance/etc. constraints
<APlayer> Humm, alright, let me try to just globally up the settings and if I feel like it, edit the configs individually
<APlayer> Where did you find the documentation for what you told me earlier?
<awang> Well
<awang> The Unity documentation gave me some idea of what the particle system was capable of
<APlayer> Uh what
<APlayer> I mean the RealPlume settings documentation
<awang> The rest was searching through the SmokeScreen source code to see what it was doing with the parameters in the cfg
<awang> Oh, I didn't have RealPlume settings documentation
<APlayer> Okay, then I'm not upping the settings today, LOL
<awang> Guess writing some at some point wouldn't hurt
<awang> Since I've done some of the work already
<awang> Sarbian's the actual master, though
<APlayer> Well, I'm not dissecting C# source codes
<awang> The source code is actually not that bad
<awang> All the lines I searched for were assignments
<awang> That and variable creations
<awang> Pretty much ignored the rest
<APlayer> I have zero idea about C#. JavaScript and tiny amounts of C are as far as it gets
<awang> Nothing I went through was C# specific
<awang> Probably looks Javascript-ish
<APlayer> Alright
<APlayer> Could you link the file then, please?
<awang> The fields in that one should correspond to the keys in the .cfg
<awang> The persistent stuff
<awang> Er
<awang> Not just the persistent stuff
<awang> like "public MultiInputCurve energy;"
<awang> I guessed that was for the energy keys in the cfg
<awang> That file passes the parameters to this one
<awang> And the second one takes care of sending parameters to Unity
<awang> Sometimes after doing some simple calculations
<awang> Sometimes not
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<APlayer> OK, let me see
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<Starwaster> hahahahah!!! amphibious BonVoyage!
<Starwaster> a little bit hackish but I have it working with Nils FUR rovers
<Starwaster> I've got a mobile science base roving around Kerbin (x10) with boat propellers so it can travel in the water
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<Slaintemaith> Are there any ~magic~ performance fixes for KSP? I have a fairly kickass machine --at least it was a year ago-- and I'm getting second-long stutters every 4-5 seconds now.
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<probus_> Try MemGraph Slaintemaith. Read the instructions closely and do what it tells you. Good Luck
<Slaintemaith> That only works so well. I've tried that one. I swear it's ~some~ mod what's doing it.
<Slaintemaith> Because when I have 'x' mods in, it's fine. But I cross some line and then off it goes.
<probus_> You are probably right. You could watch the console using alt-F12 and see if you could find a correlation.
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<awang> Slaintemaith: Tell the Unity team to hurry up with implementing sgen
<awang> Otherwise, binary search to find the offending mod?
<awang> That only works if it's a single mod causing issues though
<awang> KSP needs an easy-to-use profiler really badly
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<Mike`> KSP needs 80% of the essential mods integrated (in profiled and memory leak fixed form) :)
<Mike`> this memory leaking is ridiculous, windows auto killed my ksp while i was afk....
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<awang> Wonder how much leakage is laziness and how much is due to heap fragmentation
<awang> I'm also curious about what is going on that can cause leaks in a GC'd language
<awang> Where are things being stored?
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<Mike`> hm? on the heap
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<Mike`> creating a leak is simple in theory, just keep references to unused objects?
<TM1978m> how is every one?
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<Bornholio> rokker kinda dusty there
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<awang> Mike`: Well, yeah, I know that part
<awang> I'm just wondering what in KSP is actually doing that
<Mike`> yep, tried to use a profiler today but that didn't work :s
<awang> Using Sarbian's instructions?
<awang> Could you at least get Unity itself running?
<Mike`> nah, i used a random .net profiler and pointed it to KSPs process :)
<Mike`> didn't manage to attach though
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<Bornholio> turn on verbose on screen loggin like i do and be bugged by every mod flw in existence
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<awang> Mike`: Ah, I see
<awang> Interesting idea
<awang> Not sure if it would work since Unity might get in the way?
<awang> Hmmm
<awang> I should try to point a C++ profiler at it
<awang> Luckily, got one built-in :D
<awang> Bornholio: I'm going to join the club :P