<GregroxMun>
I've gathered some old science fiction images and I'm considering using them as a basis for a new version of Toy Solar System that is not based upon the kerbol system.
<SigmaSemi>
GregroxMun: as a function for that mod
<SigmaSemi>
what name would you think is best
<SigmaSemi>
"Swap" or "Invert" ?
<GregroxMun>
Swap
<SigmaSemi>
yeah I realized while I was writing it
<SigmaSemi>
and what should be the 2 values?
<SigmaSemi>
Rename has "OLD" and "NEW"
<SigmaSemi>
what is it that Swap should have?
<SigmaSemi>
"THIS" and "THAT" ? :D
<SigmaSemi>
"ONE" and "TWO" ?
<SigmaSemi>
FIRST and SECOND ?
<SigmaSemi>
GregroxMun^
<GregroxMun>
This and That
<GregroxMun>
no
<GregroxMun>
One and Two
<GregroxMun>
This and That is confusing
<SigmaSemi>
this and that was my favourite :D
<GregroxMun>
Star Trek III: Finding Nemoy.
<GregroxMun>
Star Trek: Keeping up with the Cardassians.
<GregroxMun>
Story idea: One In A Million. Some guy calculates that he is exactly one in a million. So he embarks on a quest to find the other 7,240 people that are just like him.
Thomas|AWAY is now known as Thomas
<Thomas>
o/
<GregroxMun>
o/
TonyAirborne has joined #Kopernicus
<SigmaSemi>
0/
<GregroxMun>
SigmaSemi, do you know what causes this bug:
<SigmaSemi>
the first one didn't contain all the spaces
<SigmaSemi>
:D
<SigmaSemi>
it cut them after the a
SigmaSemi is now known as SigmaAFK
<Thomas>
SigmaAFK: Blame IRC
<GregroxMun>
dangit he leaves just as I need him
regex has joined #Kopernicus
<GregroxMun>
o/
<GregroxMun>
!tell Sigma* I need you to tilt EchoLandMap by 90 degrees such that the north pole line on the map is a point on the equator.
<Qboid>
GregroxMun: I'll redirect this as soon as they are around.
SigmaAFK is now known as SigmaTrain
<SigmaTrain>
0/
<Qboid>
SigmaTrain: GregroxMun left a message for you in #Kopernicus [04.05.2017 17:13:49]: "I need you to tilt EchoLandMap by 90 degrees such that the north pole line on the map is a point on the equator."
<GregroxMun>
Well so much for that, huh
<SigmaTrain>
Put in the folder
<GregroxMun>
it's there
<SigmaTrain>
Ok
<SigmaTrain>
Ill do that when I get home
<SigmaTrain>
Will you be online tonight?
<SigmaTrain>
So I can create SASSx thread
<SigmaTrain>
GregroxMun^
<GregroxMun>
probably
<GregroxMun>
not between 3:30 and 5:20 EDT though
<SigmaTrain>
!wa 3.30 EDT to CEST
<Qboid>
SigmaTrain: convert 3:30 pm EDT | 04. May 2017 to Central European Time (Germany) (saving): 9:30:00 pm CEST | Thursday, May 4, 2017
<SigmaTrain>
So 9.30/11.30
<SigmaTrain>
That's fine, I usually stay up untill 2am
<SigmaTrain>
I have plenty of other stuff to do
<SigmaTrain>
So it shouldn't be a problem
<GregroxMun>
I really wish TextureReplacer used a ConfigNode structure for assigning textures, so it would work more like Kopernicus. You have TR, and then you install a mod into gamedata that includes textures and a config to replace the textures.
<SigmaTrain>
I asked them to make it ages ago
<SigmaTrain>
Some people just don't care about compatibility
<SigmaTrain>
They just care about downloads
<SigmaTrain>
I could probably write a Texture Replacer myself without even looking at the code from TR
<SigmaTrain>
It wouldn't have all the fancy features
<GregroxMun>
The community could probably make use of Sigma Textures
<SigmaTrain>
:)
<SigmaTrain>
Hahaha
<Thomas>
You could for TR, hack in your features and make a PR?
<Thomas>
s/for/fork
<Qboid>
Thomas meant to say: You could fork TR, hack in your features and make a PR?
<SigmaTrain>
Sigma Texture Substituter
<SigmaTrain>
I could
<SigmaTrain>
But I rather work on my mods
<SigmaTrain>
Plus I don't ever use TR
<SigmaTrain>
If I needed it I would have probably done it by now
<SigmaTrain>
Yesterday I fixed CSS
<SigmaTrain>
:)
<GregroxMun>
CSS?
<Qboid>
GregroxMun: [CSS] => Catalina Sky Survey
<SigmaTrain>
Nope
<Thomas>
Cascading Style Sheets?
<SigmaTrain>
Community Science Something
<GregroxMun>
Community Science Tree maybe?
<SigmaTrain>
!g CSS KSP
<Qboid>
SigmaTrain: http://forum.kerbalspaceprogram.com/index.php?/topic/8423-component-space-shuttle-v-501-july-14-2013/ [Component Space Shuttle V 5.0.1 (July 14, 2013) - Add-on ...] (11500 results found, took 0.67s)
<SigmaTrain>
The bug with CSS was that after a certain point, KSP won't display multiple science reports
<GregroxMun>
It took me something like 5 hours of work to make Sudric, one of the higher quality planets I've made in KSP. Going from that, it would take nearly 3 months of continuous work to fill up a KSP system with that many worlds.
<GregroxMun>
Oh yeah I think I remember that bug happening back before I stopped ever caring about science reports.
<SigmaTrain>
5hrs is very quick
<GregroxMun>
5 hours of work in total
<GregroxMun>
It took me several days off and on
<GregroxMun>
And that's probably a liberal estimate, quicker than it may actuall take.
<SigmaTrain>
Still, it's impressive
SigmaTrain is now known as SigmaAFK
<GregroxMun>
My planetbuilding sped up a lot way back when KittopiaTech's exporter was almost totally broken and wouldn't work when ships were on the surface. I started building purely from space instead of the ground, and honestly that's not really that great. I have lately focused only on the big picture instead of the close up terrain, relying on templates a
<GregroxMun>
nd re-used PQSMod sets to get the planet. But frankly, I don't see many other planet makers using complicated sets of PQSMods as opposed to full-on textures.
Poodmund has joined #Kopernicus
<GregroxMun>
o/
<Poodmund>
o/
<GregroxMun>
So 3 months of continuous work to make a 416 planet system under the latest Planetplanet blog post (THis one)
<GregroxMun>
Let's go ahead and count in all the existing kerbins.
<GregroxMun>
Kerbin, Kerbulus, Sudric, Barnes, Gael, Tellumo, Alterkerbin, Alterlaythe, Laythe, Lowel, Nartes, ULkerbin, ULlaythe + Tylo since they're binaries already, Earth, Altervenus, Sido's Ares, Sido's Hestia, Sido's Erato. We could also terraform Duna and Eve with minimal effort if we wanted.
<GregroxMun>
That's 21 planets. Only another 3 would be needed to complete Ultimate System type 1.
<GregroxMun>
And I swear I remember another 3 but I can't find them.
<GregroxMun>
The Kerbins I can use for sure are only Kerbin, Kerbulus, Sudric, Barnes, Lowel, Nartes, Alterkerbin, Alterlaythe, Terraduna and Terraeve. 10 out of the 24 needed.
<GregroxMun>
Not all of them need to be Kerbins. In the diagram for Ultimate Solar System 1 they depict two venuses, one mars, and a couple ocean-only worlds.
TonyAirborne has quit [Ping timeout: 186 seconds]
<SigmaAFK>
0/
SigmaAFK is now known as Sigma88
<Sigma88>
Poodmund: I'm here
<Sigma88>
give me 10 minutes to fix a couple of stuff
<Sigma88>
and then I can show you my ideas
<Sigma88>
give me a sign if you are here :)
TonyAirborne has joined #Kopernicus
<Poodmund>
o/
<Sigma88>
ok
<Sigma88>
SSDRv0.2 is released
<Sigma88>
:)
<Sigma88>
Poodmund: first of all could you check something for me?
<Poodmund>
Sure thing
<Sigma88>
I suppose for GPP you have a bunch of KK buildings already in place right?
<Sigma88>
if not you can use stock KSP
<Poodmund>
Yes we do.
<Poodmund>
A bunch of the KSC++ assets and the 4 floodlight towers from KSC Floodlight
<Sigma88>
using stock ksp would probably be the best option anyways, to start simple
<Sigma88>
but you can use GPP, I don't think it would be bad
<Sigma88>
anyways
<Sigma88>
do you have stuff which is not around ksc?
<Sigma88>
because the ksc is on a mapdecal, wich is a bit of an exception case
<Sigma88>
if not, don't worry
<Sigma88>
those will do
<Poodmund>
Errr, I'll have to create a stock 1.2.2 install. Do you have any assets/configs I could use to dump something on a piece of terrain?
<Poodmund>
I'll be honest, I've never really tinkered with KK before. I've just drawn the short straw to try and fix the issue.
<Sigma88>
no problem, you can use GPP with those assets you mentioned
<Poodmund>
I'll launch a quick sounding rocket onto some terrain and place an object down.
<Sigma88>
what I need is
<Sigma88>
that you check if the buildings are positioned correctly in the "vertical" axis
<Sigma88>
when you use SD to rescale the planet
Olympic1 is now known as Olympic1|BRB
<Sigma88>
they will be spread on a bigger area (if you resize > 1)
<Sigma88>
but that's fine for now
<Poodmund>
So basically to check if they're "snapped" to the terrain when resized?
<Sigma88>
yes
<Poodmund>
Gotcha, gimme 5 mins
<Sigma88>
assuming that they were snapped before the resize
<Sigma88>
try with resizeBuildings = 1
<Sigma88>
and also with resizeBuildings = #whatever your resize is
Olympic1|BRB is now known as Olympic1
<Poodmund>
Right I've loaded up with Resize at 10 and resizeBuildings at 1 and the asset is floating slightly above the terrain
<Poodmund>
do you want the displacement amount to get it back in contact with the terrain?
<Sigma88>
no I think it's an inherit issue with KSP which I cannot overcome
<Sigma88>
as long as the displacement is very little
<Sigma88>
like some meters
<Sigma88>
5ish
<Sigma88>
what about resizeBuildings at 10 ?
<Poodmund>
One sec, I'll grab a screenshot.
<Poodmund>
The issue with KK is that when you open the editor, I think it reloads the asset's values from the config so it shoots down a few hundred meters to the altitude before the rescale. :/
<Sigma88>
yeah, don't open the editor :)
<Sigma88>
It's an issue with the models, I could go into details about it, but it's honestly a bunch of boring stuff
<Poodmund>
Is it because the transform is at the models CoM or something?
<Sigma88>
no, as far as I can tell the models have an origin point that not always is at the same altitude as the base
<Sigma88>
it's not necessarily CoM
<Sigma88>
usually it is below the base
<Poodmund>
Yeah I presumed it was because the transform point is not at a good location.
<Sigma88>
it could be solved by making the models have the origin point at the same altitude as the base
<Poodmund>
Hmmm, thats gonna be pretty much unsolvable, no?
<Poodmund>
Yeah
<Poodmund>
But theres nothing you can do to counter that in SD though.
<Sigma88>
it could be solvable, adding a value in the cfg that tells SD how much that difference is
<Sigma88>
but it's not something I am interested in adding for now
<Poodmund>
If the KK mod authors have to do that, they may as well just reposition the transform point in the .mu.
<Sigma88>
I am trying to make SD work with any mods that might add Cities
<Sigma88>
not just kk
<Sigma88>
for now I am interested in fixing the groups
<Sigma88>
after that I may consider adding those values if the issue still remains
<Sigma88>
I will add the ability to read those values, not the values themselves
<Sigma88>
but you get the point
<Sigma88>
with resizeBuildings = 10 the result should be better
<Sigma88>
right?
<Poodmund>
Assuming that the positive y direction of the transform in the assets have been directioned to be "perpendicular" to the terrain is there any way to read the extent of the bounds of the mesh collider and calculate the base of the model from that?
<Sigma88>
yes but that function of KSP doesn't work very well
<Sigma88>
the altitude of terrain is not always correct
<Poodmund>
subdivision resolution of the pqs is not high enough?
<Poodmund>
I think the issue will obviously be different based on each individual asset.
<Poodmund>
My assumption from that screenshot would be that the transform for that asset is located ever so slightly below the actual bottom of the model
<Sigma88>
it's always below
<Poodmund>
The stock scale setup had the rightmost tank clipping the terrain exactly on its edge.
<Sigma88>
when you make a model you tend to work in the positive region, not at the bottom of the space
<Sigma88>
ok
<Sigma88>
I'll probably have to check it again
<Poodmund>
But what I mean is it seems as though on that asset its located ever so slightly negative on the y.
<Sigma88>
just to make sure I can't do anything better
<Poodmund>
So when resized the offset increases, and when the building resize is increased that offset it getting greater.
<Sigma88>
it could be
<Poodmund>
The magnitude of the issue is dependent on the individual asset... which sucks for you.
<Sigma88>
yup
<Sigma88>
let me check something
<Sigma88>
could you check the cfgs for what the settings of that tank are?
<Sigma88>
this means that, it calculates the "builtInOffset"
<Sigma88>
which is the difference between the altitude of the object and the altitude of the terrain
<Poodmund>
Makes sense
<Sigma88>
groundLevel / (resize * landscape)
<Sigma88>
which is the original ground altitude
<Sigma88>
and 1076.458984375
<Sigma88>
which is the original altitude of the building
<Sigma88>
then
<Sigma88>
it changes the offset
<Sigma88>
to be
<Sigma88>
the current ground level + the offset (multiplied by the resizeBuildings)
<Poodmund>
assuming that that the transform is located centrally in that case?
<Poodmund>
inside the model
<Sigma88>
it should work regardless
Thomas is now known as Thomas|AWAY
<Poodmund>
If it was at the base of a model, the resizeBuildings value wouldn't be wanted to affect the offset in that case though, right?
<Sigma88>
right
<Poodmund>
Hence the predicament
<Sigma88>
if it was at the base then ground altitude = repositionRadiusOffset
<Sigma88>
which means, offset = 0
<Poodmund>
Yeah. Which would be easy to get SD to function "correctly" with
<Sigma88>
I'm not sure
<Sigma88>
I'm not sure the number KSP gives out as ground altitude is correct
<Sigma88>
for how I calculate the altitude
<Sigma88>
you would expect it to work fine regardless of the transform offset
<Sigma88>
no?
<Poodmund>
What about importing some cubic building models into blender from their .mu files, putting them into a Unity scene, adding the transform at the flat base of that model and rexporting it. See the behavior of the statics when the transform is exactly as the base plane of the model
<Sigma88>
you know how to do that?
<Poodmund>
Kinda
<Poodmund>
Haha
<Poodmund>
A little outside my remit. :P
<Sigma88>
if you can provide me with a building like that it would definitely come in handy
<Sigma88>
anyways
<Poodmund>
Im gonna have to have a play around I think
<Sigma88>
don't worry
<Sigma88>
I didn't want to talk altitude anyways :D
<Sigma88>
I want to talk long/lat
<Sigma88>
so basically
<Sigma88>
I don't know how familiar you are with the concept of Groups in SD
<Sigma88>
PQSCity Groups
<Sigma88>
or are you doing blender right now?
<Sigma88>
Poodmund ^
<Poodmund>
I can still chat
<Sigma88>
ok
<Poodmund>
Do PQSCity objects get tagged with a named 'group' key?
<Sigma88>
not really
<Sigma88>
the base idea is that you write a cfg with a list of PQSCity mods
<Sigma88>
(the names)
<Sigma88>
so that SD knows that they have to be considered part of the same group of buildings
<Sigma88>
then you need to tell SD the coordinates of the center
<Sigma88>
so that ultimately SD calculates the new long/lat for all PQSCity mods
<Sigma88>
my problem right now is how to define the syntax of this Grouping thing
<Sigma88>
Poodmund: just say that if KK used unique names for PQSCity it would be far easier for you guys to integrate KK into GPP
<Sigma88>
and if it would be possible to add that feature
<Poodmund>
Hopefully he has a bit of a sense of humour. Tried to be a little light hearted.
<Sigma88>
:)
<Poodmund>
This whole thing though... it would be so much easier if KSP has a strong portion of their dev team that were intrinsically rooted in the modding community and understood the needs and developments of the modding scene... oh wait.
<GregroxMun>
y'all, who would be good modders to consider for the ultimate solar system team?
<Poodmund>
I say that last comment in, like, 99% jest.
<Poodmund>
Ignoring JPLRepos presence.. :D ... what are you guy's thoughts on the DLC?
<GregroxMun>
I'm looking forwards to it because I get it for free.
<Sigma88>
GregroxMun: KillAshley :D
<GregroxMun>
KillAshley is MIA tho
<Sigma88>
Poodmund: I don't even know what it is
<GregroxMun>
It's called Making History
<GregroxMun>
It's gonna have new historical space race rocket parts and a mission planner.
<Poodmund>
Hah! I mean, personally, I get it... surprised it didn't come sooner. I think the Paradox Interactive model would not be a bad suitor if they went down that line of development release.
regex has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
<Sigma88>
I've seen a lot of people getting fuzzy about it being a paid DLC
<Poodmund>
Anyway, i hope its received well... don't think I can handle another crap-shoot big drama fest. :(
<GregroxMun>
shall I ask Amarius?
<Sigma88>
-.-
<Sigma88>
amarius is not that bad lately
<Sigma88>
as a planet developer
<Sigma88>
as a collaborator I have no idea
<Poodmund>
God the Ariane 5 is ugly.
<Poodmund>
Anyway, I have to be up in a few hours. :/ Laters all o/
<Sigma88>
0/
<GregroxMun>
are you going to do the SASSx thread?