<xShadowx|2> i wonder if the soviets ever locked a man inside a rocket (without control) before the whole send an accual cosmonaut bit, for purposes of first man into space juuuust incase they didnt get official people up before the americans
<borntosleep> hey the three guys that dies don't kount
<borntosleep> komrade the vodka is not strong enough
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<soundnfury> xShadowx|2: they didn't, but they considered it (so did the americans and even the british!)
<soundnfury> although that said, Gagarin didn't have control of his ship at all because they were afraid he'd go space crazy
<xShadowx|2> XD
<xShadowx|2> hows that any diff than surface-idiot-crazy?
<soundnfury> remember: at this point no-one had any idea what the physiological effects of microgravity might be
<xShadowx|2> tbh id assume itd be fine, until said issue happens
<taniwha> upper center screen messages :)
<xShadowx|2> trees o.o
<taniwha> no trees in the messages (behind them, sure)
<xShadowx|2> taniwha: someone should make a mod adding more ground scatter :| i completely forgot it existed because stupid ksp default is off
<taniwha> still, have hotplug support now :)
<xShadowx|2> thats your joystick name i assume?
<taniwha> as given by either the throttle or the kernel
<taniwha> (dunno where the name is stored, but I extract it from the device file)
<taniwha> (ie, from /dev/input/eventNN)
<xShadowx|2> as for windows joystick, shouldnt need c++ for joystick, directx has stuff for it
<xShadowx|2> uh slimdx is what i always used for newer dx (havent touched joystick though)
<taniwha> PRs welcome :)
<xShadowx|2> never touched joystick side ;p
<taniwha> there's always a first time for everything :)
<xShadowx|2> seems like winblows should have some access without dx though
<xShadowx|2> but then im not sure if itll break things when ksp runs in ogl o.o
<taniwha> it has various bits for windows
<xShadowx|2> ah hes using sharpdx
<xShadowx|2> never tried it, wonder how compares to slimdx
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<borntosleep> good job taniwha nice to see more improvements
<taniwha> borntosleep: next step is a decent UI
<taniwha> got plenty of bindings happening, but you have to hand-edit the config files
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<taniwha> very inconvenient
<Bornholio> now if it could handle my space navigator 6dof device :P
<taniwha> Bornholio: it has linear brakes :)
<Bornholio> i saw
<taniwha> space navigator...
<taniwha> hmmm
<Bornholio> yes the 3dConnexion one, pretty handy for CAD and so such allways wanted it for games too
<taniwha> interesting, linux support
<taniwha> heh, there's a place /in/ Wakayama that sells them
<Bornholio> oh no i've converted somone!
<Bornholio> someone
<taniwha> I've been mildly interested for a while
<taniwha> just always thought "bah, probably no support"
<Bornholio> I prefer the simple one with only two buttons to the big multifunction one
<taniwha> oh, misinterpreted
<taniwha> 0 hits
<taniwha> the google maps marker was just marking Wakayama
<xShadowx|2> hmm.....voyager mid s4 atm, but have an odd itch to watch stargate through again
<xShadowx|2> and be about 2 months when i inish voyager ;(
<taniwha> some in Osaka
<taniwha> (90m train ride)
<Bornholio> sounds like shipping it time
<Bornholio> unless you have a reason to head to osaka
<taniwha> not immediately, though I am looking for one
<Bornholio> walked around in osaka when i was there, was a nice place
<taniwha> yeah
<Bornholio> stayed in nishinomiya
<taniwha> and Denden town is pretty cool (equivalent to Akihabara)
<taniwha> amazon.jp has them
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<taniwha> I have to go out for a while. bbl
<Bornholio> what town did you say you are in Taniwha
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<blowfish> evening
<awang> What's the difference between "unthrottleable" and "throttle locked"?
<awang> blowfish: \o
<awang> How goes the MM work?
<blowfish> been moving all day, haven't had a chance to look yet
<awang> Ah, busy day?
<blowfish> yeah, new apartment
<blowfish> well not apartment, really cottage, but still a rental
<blowfish> and moving is a lot of work
<awang> Oh nice!
<awang> Why a cottage?
<awang> Sounds like a rather interesting choice
<blowfish> it's what we (me and my roommate) found
<blowfish> in the area we want, reasonable rent, month to month
<blowfish> okay let's see if the lazy option works ... duplicate 1.2.2 RO install, run CKAN to update everything that has been updated, install DLLs
<blowfish> err, replace KSP with 1.3 is somewhere in there
<blowfish> only 40k ish patches, quite a far cry from your install awang, but hopefully still enough to get meaningful performance numbers
<blowfish> I could think about installing a few more mods to up the patch count
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<awang> Hopefully as long as you have the ones that took a while for me (RO, RP-0, TF) you should be good
<awang> Hopefully
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<awang> And there's always the nuclear option of Dropboxing you my install
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<taniwha> Bornholio: wakayama
<Bornholio> I showed my son images of the kansai airport there and he was amazed.
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<borntosleep> have a good day :)
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<taniwha> it's a pretty cool airport
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<lamont> awang: do you have all the things running on 1.3?
<awang> lamont: Minus Principia, yes
<awang> Er
<awang> Well, including Principia
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<awang> idk what I was thinking there
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<awang> !tell NathanKell* What's the difference between "throttle locked" and "unthrottleable"?
<Qboid> awang: I'll redirect this as soon as they are around.
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<lamont> ICD10 codes involving the word “spacecraft”: http://www.icd10data.com/search?s=spacecraft
<awang> lamont: ?
<lamont> its like a checklist of everyone’s kerbal career...
<lamont> we need fire as a thing
<lamont> oops, forgot the fire extinguishers and sprinkler system…
<lamont> * watches fire spread to fuel tanks…
<ProjectThoth> Watch out for the FOOF containers!
<awang> Oh jeeze
<awang> Hey, how about we add paperwork to RO
<awang> Can't beat that for realism!
<awang> And sort of off topic
<awang> How can I get the current engine config in ModuleEngineRF?
<blowfish> ModuleEnginesRF doesn't know about configs
<blowfish> you want ModuleEngineConfigs
<awang> blowfish: Well...
<awang> I'm trying to make some changes to the RF GUI to show some more info
<awang> What I'm trying to do right now is display the rated burn time for the currently selected config
<awang> Since the only other way is to select a different engine config, then hover over the button for the original config
<awang> Which seems like awkward UX to me
<blowfish> it is
<blowfish> the other problem is that the rated burn time is actually on a test flight module
<awang> Right
<blowfish> not on the engine itself
<blowfish> so how does it show the rated burn time for the other configs?
<blowfish> (how does it access that info)
<awang> blowfish: The TF/RF interop adds the information to a "description" field in a ModuleEngineConfigs ConfigNode
<awang> If that makes sense
<blowfish> strange
<awang> So I was thinking if I can access that same node, I can get that information
<awang> Oh wait
<awang> I see
<awang> It grabs all ModuleEngineConfigs using part.partPrefab.Modules
<awang> Iterates over those
<awang> idk if that's the way I want to do it though
<awang> Not ot mention I'm not sure how to check whether I got the right config if I did do it that way
<awang> I guess a better way of describing what I'm doing is trying to make the information shown in the main RF engine UI and its popup windows consistent
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<awang> Sorry, computer crashed
<awang> Did I miss anything?
<blowfish> nope
<awang> btw, is part.mass the right way to get an engine mass?
<awang> Even with different configs?
<blowfish> I would imagine the mass would be set
<blowfish> I forget whether ModuleEnginesRF or ModuleEngineConfigs does the mass setting though
<awang> idk
<awang> I just wanted to get TWR information in the RF window
<awang> So I don't really mind who sets the mass
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<lamont> we need paperwork. along with finances, inflation, collateralized debt obligations and stock market crashes.
<ProjectThoth> Super Realism Overhaul.
<lamont> plus as geopolitical tensions ratchet down your finances may actually contract, setting your space programs back by decades, it’ll be super realistic…
<awang> Oh, can we add Congressional hearings too?
<lamont> totally!
<ProjectThoth> "Yeah, we're gonna have to change things up, Nixon just won the 1960 election..."
<lamont> that’s the most important part of running a space program, lots of in game play should be based around that
<awang> PTSD complaints incoming...
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<awang> Hmmm
<awang> RO/RP-0 doesn't do April Fool's updates, do they?
<ProjectThoth> There's no reason we can't start...
<ProjectThoth> And by "we" I mean the actual devs.
<awang> It's going to be tricky though
<awang> We're pretty short on man-hours as is
<awang> Don't want to end up wasting too much time
<ProjectThoth> I mean, if you're talking a literal shitpost here, I could make up some screenshots 'n things.
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<awang> Is RP-0 balanced with ScrapYard in mind?
<awang> For part recovery?
<awang> I mean, yes, recovery doesn't cover rollout costs
<awang> But you can get some pretty insane time savings when building rockets with rescued parts
<awang> Like a basic Aerobee goes from ~1 month to build to ~1 week
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<soundnfury> TF struck a launch of my spessplane and Vasily had to execute a transatlantic abort.
<soundnfury> still stayed under 2.4g though :)
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<BadRocketsCo> Howdy
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<BadInternetCo> Has anyone here tried the hab pack on 1.2.2 RP0?
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<awang> How does the kOS PID compare to MJ's?
<borntosleep> https://ksp-kos.github.io/KOS/tutorials/pidloops.html mechjeb has transformed a few times, i'm not sure can be tuned in the current builds
<borntosleep> those kOS PID loops would be somewhat CPU heavy but you could easily lower it by changing time step
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<lamont> MJ now has the kOS PID loop in it in the dev builds
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<lamont> the default kOS PID loop is a bit too stiff and overshoots when there isn’t enough torque authority (like in most RO rockets with RCS) and functions a bit better with the stock “MOAR Reaction Wheels!” approach. but that is likely a function of tuning, and it just needs tuning for RO
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<awang> Oh, didn't realize that they have the same PID loops now
<awang> That would certainly explain the behavior I saw when trying to point my rocket for correction burns though
<lamont> sarbian also implemented a “hybrid” one which he claims works better, i have dug into what it is...
<lamont> poke around the attitude adjustment menus, they’ve had an overhaul
<awang> Well, time to fire up Google to learn what everything there actually means
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<Sarbian> "claim" is a strong word :) It looked nice in my limited tests
<awang> What's the right way to toggle part highlighting in-flight?
<awang> Actually, never mind
<awang> I'm dumb
<awang> Again
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<awang> Why does RP-0 disable hibernation?
<awang> Seems like it'd be a useful feature, especially for the super power-hungry early probe cores
<awang> Also, for the Unity UI wizards here
<awang> Is it possible to add a custom button to a scrollview created by GUILayout.BeginScrollView()?
<awang> Or do I have to use GUILayout.Button?
<taniwha> awang: early probes didn't have hibernation, I guess
<taniwha> and isn't GUILayout.Button custom enough?
<awang> RP-0 appears to disable hibernation for *all* parts with ModuleCommand
<awang> Not just the early ones
<taniwha> taht's a bit off
<awang> It'd just be nice to be able to use avionics for lunar insertion without bringing along a crapton of batteries
<awang> Since early solar panels are super weak
<awang> Well
<awang> I want to create a button which highlights a particular part on mouse hovering over it
<awang> And have text that changes based on whether it was toggled or not
<awang> I didn't see the corresponding methods for GUILayout.Button
<awang> And I didn't see how to get a handle to the created button either
<awang> So I thought the next best thing would be to subclass UnityEngine.UI.Button and implement the behaviors in there, then add the custom button to the scrollview
<awang> But my Google-fu failed me, and I'm sort of stuck now
<taniwha> ah, there's a GUILayout (related) function to get the rect used for the last specified element
<taniwha> you can then test if the mouse pointer is in that rect
<awang> Wait, where?
<taniwha> so GUILayout.Button (whatever); rect = GUILayoutsomething.somethingaboutgetrect (); "if mouse in rect"...
<awang> Oh
<awang> I see it
<awang> GUILayoutUtility.Get[Last]Rect
<taniwha> yeah
<taniwha> in fact, the example code for GetLastRect does just what you want
<awang> Indeed, it does
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<awang> Thanks!
<awang> Now just need to figure out how to best integrate this
<taniwha> yeah, but you have a path forward now :)
<taniwha> glad I could help
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