Judge_Dedd changed the topic of #KSPOfficial to: Kerbal Space Program official channel | Latest versions: 1.8.1, NaN | Rules: tinyurl.com/KSP-Rules | "modcall" to call ops | ΔV maps: https://i.imgur.com/CHVnEeE.png https://i.imgur.com/gBoLsSt.png | Type "chanlog" for logs | Starlink 3 delayed due to weather
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<transit> bwoop
<darsie> .
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<transit_> Bwoop
<transit_> O jeeze am I already here?
<transit_> Yes, yes I am.
<transit_> Nite, all!
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<Althego> lol
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<Flayer> jeb and bob have returned from duna!
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* UmbralRaptop declares Duna kraken-free
<hatrix> do you have screenshots Flayer?
<Flayer> nah
<hatrix> I'm always interested in rocket designs
<hatrix> last time I went to Duna I managed to get Bob stranded
<hatrix> and the rescue mission put him in orbit of the sun…
<Flayer> it was a pretty standard apollo design, although constructed out of two launches
* darsie 's gas station on Minmus: http://bksys.at/bernhard/temp/screenshot110.png
<darsie> Had to split the departure burn over three passes since the Spark is so weak.
<darsie> But fine for landing on Minmus.
<darsie> Landing was a bit rough, but the wheels handled it well.
<darsie> Stupid me didn't want to support the brakes with a burn to slow down the rolling vehicle to save fuel. Forgot it has a refinery :).
<Flayer> lol
<Flayer> i need a duna-to-orbit fuel transport i think
<darsie> Did you use the dv map to plan your return missions?
<Flayer> i dont know what that is, so i doubt it
<darsie> It's in the topic.
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<Flayer> i just did it by feel/overkill
<Flayer> "overkill" which turned out to be just enough with some aerobreaking
<Mat2ch> darsie: I fear you have to explain what dV means ;)
<Mat2ch> Fluburtur!
<Mat2ch> Fluburtur: what are you up to lately?
<Mat2ch> I always think at you when I visit my parents. There's still so much stuff for you there ;)
<darsie> dv (or correctly Δv) is the change in velocity you can achieve with a rocket: Δv=v_e*ln(m0/m1). v_e=exhaust velocity=Isp(specific impulse)*g(~9.81 m/s2). m0=initial/wet rocket mass, m1=final/dry rocket mass.
<darsie> Flayer: ^
<Flayer> well i have no idea what any of that means
<Flayer> but i am aware of 'dv'
<Flayer> its the numbers on the left
<darsie> To get from LKO to the Mun you need to increase your speed by 860 m/s, according to the dv map.
<darsie> Flayer: Don't be scared of what I wrote. Read it slowly.
<Flayer> i'm not scared, just not that interested
<darsie> But you don't actually need to know how to calculate it yourself, since recent versions of KSP do it for you.
<Flayer> exactly!
<darsie> Δv=v_e*ln(m0/m1) is a quite simple formula, though.
<hatrix> before understanding the physics, my journeys always were a failure
<hatrix> now it's still the same, but I know why :p
<darsie> :)
<Flayer> tee-hee
<Flayer> i feel like going to the supermarket and getting a big box of peanut butter candies
<Flayer> but i'm not sure if they will even have them
<hatrix> sounds like diabetes
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<darsie> Rather than making rockens by feel/overkill, I prefer to make calculated minimal missions, like this one way trip to Duna: http://bksys.at/bernhard/temp/screenshot104.png
<darsie> Sometimes I'm not sure if it works out and test it.
<Flayer> i doubt i would be able to get that into orbit lol
<Flayer> also my kerbonaut would be doa
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<hatrix> already saw that screenshot :)
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<darsie> Flayer: Do you use a life support mod?
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<Flayer> yus
<darsie> ok
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<darsie> I could have used only one Oscar B tank, I think and used the jetpack for the remaining dv. But this way was more convenient.
<packbart> I'll start the next career without life-support mods and go back to the good old ways. I've been using Tac-LS before and now Kerbalism which is frustrating me a bit with its time-warp weirdness
<Flayer> i got snacks cause its nice and simple
<darsie> Kerbals are plants. All they need is Sun :).
<UmbralRaptop> pacifist orks
<Flayer> nah, my kerbals are underground dwellers
<darsie> Maybe some tardigrades to turn the oxygen back to CO2 :).
<darsie> Flayer: Get some artificial lights, then :).
<sandbox> Urist Kerman
<darsie> Admittedly, it took some trial and error tuning to get this and other rockets to work.
<darsie> Those are declared simulations.
<darsie> Like, I tilt the rocket so it flies just too low, so I have to fly straight for a certain while (e.g. till I reach a certain speed) before switching to prograde hold.
<darsie> That reaction wheel is in this position cause it counterbalances the seat that has to be off center to fit the horizontal Kerbal in the fairing.
<Flayer> in better news
<Flayer> it appears my toothache has been resolved
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<Tsar_bomba> What are the rules, they are blocked for me
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<packbart> The rules are offline.
<Flayer> there's one that says 'no cursing' i think
<packbart> the tinyurl should probably redirect to https://forum.kerbalspaceprogram.com/index.php?/guidelines/ but instead it links to an archive.org copy
<Althego> mothership. drives offline
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<UmbralRaptop> ah, driveby questions
<packbart> returning customer
<Tank2333_> asking questions and leaving after 5 seconds?
<Althego> why bother asking the question if they dont wait for the answer?
<packbart> why bother asking yourself that question? because people :)
<Althego> because science
<Althego> self playing banjo
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<UmbralRaptop> Why are humans like that?
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<transit1> reminds me of the time a woman and her child asked me which train goes to nyc from trenton, to which i replied "this one does, and the next one, but the next one is an express, so it gets in quite a bit before this one"
<transit1> they thanked me then boarded the local
<transit1> express pulls in 5 minutes later, i board, ride, get out at newark for my routine switch to PATH
<transit1> train comes in on track 1 while i'm texting with my girlfriend at the time
<transit1> (trakc 1 is connected to the PATH system across the same platform)
<transit1> lady and kid come off the train, look at me like i have 3 heads
<Althego> cikin separated?
<transit1> yeah maybe i knew what i was talking about after all :P
<Althego> colon
<Althego> (because PATH)
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<transit1> its a system that connects hudson county with new york county across the hudson river and operated by the ny nj port authority hence PA TH port authority trans hudson
<transit1> anyways, i was a nyc tour guide for 6 years and i can confirm that people are a pain in the buttocks
<transit1> myself included
<transit1> :D
<Althego> hehe
<Althego> i am quite sure neanderthals were better people, but we killed them all, so we are the surviving evils
<transit1> we have some of their genes
<transit1> so now we can have orange or red hair .. and wear jeans?
<transit1> darwin's hunger games
<Althego> still ongoing
<transit1> cognitive bias
<Althego> doesnt end as long as there are living things on the planet
<transit1> i think some people when they drive use cognitive bias ply tires.. they just have way less control and are inferior handling
<Mat2ch> The problem with thinking is: You've got to have time and energy for that. Our modern society deprives us from both things.
<Althego> how so
<Mat2ch> Well, not you and my obviously. We both have time to hang around in this channel and chat all day
<Mat2ch> but look at the rest of society
<Althego> hehe
<Mat2ch> I could use a project, though
<Mat2ch> not earning any money in January hurts my feelings
<Althego> technically i am here all day, but not really listtening
<Althego> but you dont have a boss
<Mat2ch> and also no money to buy me nice things :P
<Mat2ch> well, I need not only nice things, but to replace a few things here
<Mat2ch> Worst part is that I'm waiting for two companies to give me a call. If I have to wait any longer I'll start looking for new projects
<Althego> "ring ring, why dont you give me a call?"
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<Mat2ch> Tomorrow I'll bother the first one :D
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<Mat2ch> I'm a bit sad that there are so few tandem rotor helicopters
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<Tank2333_> ill can confirm that in a bluecollor/industrial job industrial automation killed a lot of thinking time, because you have to pay attention to something without having anything to do most of the time,
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<Tank2333_> also often the "free" time you gain when a process gets automated is used for more low skilled work like hauling
<Althego> worse, excel sheets :)
<Althego> the biggest lie in moden history. it doesn help anybody
<Tank2333_> :)
<Althego> hehe i remember we were often hunting with the siemens support guy suitable wooden parts behind the warehouse for the air cushion floatation thing
<Mat2ch> You mean the Siemens Lufthaken.
<Mat2ch> :P
<Tank2333_> i wish i could use excel for the planning steps in my daily parts list i have to do, but half of the people that work at thos machines dont have computers at home
<Althego> hehe no
<Althego> anyway working in factories is one of the biggest waste of time
<Althego> so elon wants people on mars until 2050? isnt that way later than he originally planned?
<Tank2333_> some people are made for it though, but general there is no personal development to be had
<Althego> exactly
<Tank2333_> 2050 is even later than nasa
<Althego> maybe i should watch thevideo to see what he meant by that
<Althego> maybe colonists, not just people
<Tank2333_> yeah
<packbart> Mat2ch: The problem with thinking is that it requires too much order. Entropy will win in the end
<Tank2333_> one time a apprentice said to me "i feel like people here can only do things fast and not good anymore" i could only nod to him... kind of sad
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<packbart> you didn't have the time for a proper answer and had to do it fast? ;)
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<Althego> so next starlink is on friday
<Tank2333> packbart exactly
<Althego> hehe
<Tank2333> how will starlink be priced? is that out yot?
<Tank2333> yet
<packbart> I can already feel the howls of astrophysicists on another channel
<Althego> hehe
<NGC3982> already?
<packbart> Tank2333: both customers share the costs
<Althego> liek the famous obi wan quote about alderaan?
<NGC3982> i thought commercial usage of starlink was years away
<Althego> probably
<Althego> i dont remember but they need few hundred to start making any use of it
<Althego> and that is only for tests
<Althego> and thousands for any commercial usage
<Althego> they want what, 12000?
<Tank2333> +3000 from oneweb
<Althego> is that the amazon thing?
<packbart> I wonder how many StarPing sats China is going to want to launch
<Tank2333> and amzon will get onto that band wagon too i guess
<Althego> supposedly with starship they can launch 400 at one time
<transit1> they should name the first one "jefferson"
<Althego> why
<Tank2333> starship i pretty far out i think
<Althego> they need a few years for that
<Althego> it is very much in the early stages
<Althego> i think if they can make it to comercial usage in 5 years they were really fast
<Tank2333> maybe they have to ditch the stainless steel in situ building
<transit1> why?
<transit1> :D
<transit1> they played bowie, why not jefferson starship?
<transit1> plus its pretty fitting of spacex
<Althego> arent they somewhat off?
<transit1> building a dream etc
<Althego> with the pitch
<transit1> it's polychromatic
<Althego> it sounds disturbing
<Tank2333> polychromatic, jeez
<Tank2333> even chromatic sounds bad
<transit1> most choral work is polychromatic, as people have differing vocal timbre
<Tank2333> but they dont sing half a halfstep notes from each other
<Althego> ah elon wants 1 million people on mars by 2050
<Althego> that is a city
<Tank2333> a city is 10000
<Althego> by name
<Tank2333> one million is a small country
<transit1> we built this city?
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<Althego> i wouldnt feel good in a city with 100k people
<transit1> :D
<Tank2333> to small?
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<Althego> yes, too small
<transit1> we built this city on rocks & soil
<Tank2333> 100k is a good size, you still have cultural things going on with 50 below it gets realy boring :)
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<Tank2333> but the smaller the city the nicer the people
<UmbralRaptor> ahahahahah
<Tank2333> in the villages around here if the employees in shops have a very good modd in general
<Tank2333> -if
<Althego> good modding comunity :)
<UmbralRaptor> I'd suggest that you need >500k to have interesting restaurants barring cities that make culture a big deal
<transit1> dont you remember? We built this city! We built this city on rock & soil!
<UmbralRaptor> Anyway, 1e6 people to Mars in 30 years is, uh,
<Althego> make it 20
<packbart> how many of them alive?
<Althego> because you need to get the whole thing going, that is at least 10 years
<Althego> if not 20
<Althego> lol
<UmbralRaptor> okay, 91 to 137 people per day
<Althego> not a big deal if you have hundreds of starships
<Althego> but this name is really dumb
<Althego> could have named it the silver rod of joy :?)
<UmbralRaptor> How many launch windows are there between now and 2050, anyway?
<Tank2333> 2
<Althego> isnt it 2 years 2 months?
<UmbralRaptor> Something like that
<Althego> around 13?
<Althego> maybe 14
<UmbralRaptor> call it 14 windows, including the one *this year*
<Althego> and lose around 4 of that
<UmbralRaptor> Yeah, so on the order of 100k people per window
<Althego> so make it 10, which means 100k people in each window?
<Althego> that is an exodus
<packbart> transport the colonists in dehydrated form, melt ice on Mars to resurrect them
<UmbralRaptor> Why say 1 million instead of a plausible 10s, optimistically 100s?
<Althego> hehe
<Althego> like water ebars?
<packbart> yes, I've listened to the first Trisolaris (audio)book
* UmbralRaptor gestures at Antarctica
<UmbralRaptor> human-tardigrade hybrids!
<Tank2333> i get reminded of startrek discovery... please no
<Althego> hehe
<UmbralRaptor> Haven't seen that one
<Althego> we live in a time when start trek is not star trek and star wars is not star wars
<Althego> i was never a doctor who fan, but voount that in too
<UmbralRaptor> So, 40k movies when?
<packbart> hauling water bags is so inefficient. the future are travelluing virtual minds in computer bays
* packbart likes The Culture, too
<Tank2333> also jumanji is not jumanji anymore
<Tank2333> jurassic park too
<UmbralRaptor> Feathered dinosaurs when?
<Tank2333> and a Matrix reboot is in the making i heard...
<Tank2333> just no...
<Tank2333> UmbralRaptor never
<Tank2333> i would love that though
<Tank2333> the amount of francises hollywood has tried to reboot and turned into garbage is mind boggling
<packbart> no worries. KSP 2 is going to be great
<Tank2333> its if they only want to make money and dont care about the art..
<Tank2333> i hope so :)
<Althego> continuing my though, supposedly the upcoming dune is going to be good
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<Althego> i tell you what, princess bride remake
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<Althego> at least there was a rumour about that last year
<Althego> why would anybody want to make that?
<Althego> ok, money, but it can only be a failure
<packbart> Sissi!
<Tank2333> not sure i evene know that movie
<Tank2333> im up for sissi
<Tank2333> watched the 3 movies with a freind lately :)
<Tank2333> but i guess it would have 20 minutes of mindless action scenes at the end
<Althego> hehe nerd question, did intel or boeing had the worse year in 2019?
<packbart> I'd say Boeing. Intel is still selling chips and can't be tied directly to any deaths
<UmbralRaptor> same
<packbart> (probably not counting missile CPUs)
<Althego> doubt those are intel
<UmbralRaptor> Hm. Boeing doesn't make any ground attack aircraft, right?
<Althego> did any of you get that yt ad about a social business something site with the grey haired guy with the fat head? a friend of mine told me that was alec baldwin. i was like, whaaaat
* UmbralRaptor has been running adblockers for ~15 years, so no
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<Althego> anyway it was shocking to see the difference to the image i had of him in my head. it was so big i didnt recognize him. this also means i am getting old too
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* transit1 noms tuna sandwitches & apple juice
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<transit> Test
<transit> O good
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<Althego> o not good
<Althego> or rather x not good
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<UmbralRaptor> ❌⭕
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<darsie> Can we remove rule "Changing the subject of conversation in a thread without a natural tie to the topic at hand;" ?
<darsie> Is this the international section?
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<Guest8169> For IRC purposes?
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<raptop> We've, uh, been stuck with that for ages for no good reason, and politely ignore it
<nate> "in a thread" doesn't sound very IRC relative
<nate> or were the IRC rules written by someone with more forum moderation experiences than IRC? lol
<raptop> The former
<nate> makes sense then :P