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<soundnfury>
ahh, I do love needlessly convoluted mission architectures...
<soundnfury>
land probe (with film camera) on moon. ascent vehicle carries data, into LLO. Send a Gemini to rendezvous, EVA across to get data, take data home. ??? Profit
<leudaimon>
lol your design?
<waerloga>
we require video recap! :P
<leudaimon>
was this planned, or something went wrong and you had to rescue the film?
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<soundnfury>
leudaimon: this was the plan, right from the start
<leudaimon>
wow... didn't you think about using an unmanned probe for the pick up? or did you intend to do other stuff while on orbit?
<soundnfury>
did do other stuff. LLO/1 contract, got some crew reports I was missing
<soundnfury>
waerloga: sadly, my computer cannot take video and run KSP at the same time
<leudaimon>
ow, all right then! looks interesting... nice to combine
<leudaimon>
btw, anybody knows how much delta-v the lunar module descent and ascent modules had?
<soundnfury>
leudaimon: yeah, imho it's a pretty neat way to improve the return from a lunar orbit crewed mission, without having to go all the way to lunar landing and Saturn V and all that
<ale260382>
2470 descent / 2220 ascent
<SirKeplan>
that's quite a fair bit of margin
<leudaimon>
soundnfury yeah,that's what I thought...
<leudaimon>
huge margin... but I guess they couldn't afford to take the risk with so many to go wrong... there were unmanned similar return missions before, right?
<leudaimon>
there were no unmanned*
<soundnfury>
leudaimon: indeed, iirc first robotic sample return was Luna something in about '71-ish (?)
<SirKeplan>
soviet saple returns happened at about the same time
<waerloga>
soviets did uncrewed returns...don't recall exactly when though
<SirKeplan>
1970
<leudaimon>
oh sure... but at this point there were no cross of info, i guess
<soundnfury>
Luna 16, Sept '70, sayeth wikipedia
<leudaimon>
cool, after apollo 11 anyway
<SirKeplan>
R.I.P Luna 15
* soundnfury
almost always names his rovers somethingkhod
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<kiwi>
eh, was that a forbidden question? :/
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<stratochief>
o/ AlimOncul
<Qboid>
stratochief: Raidernick left a message for you in #RO [11.03.2017 21:52:34]: "I fixed the conflicts in RP0 can you please merge ALL of my pr's now before they break again they have been open for almost 8 months now"
<AlimOncul>
hello
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<stratochief>
should the RP-0 heatshields be in Survivability, instead of General Construction? in my current install of RP-0 in 1.2, Survivability is basically empty
<leudaimon>
according to tree.yml it is in survivability
<leudaimon>
stratochief, general construction has the lunar heatshields
<stratochief>
ahh, you pre-answered my follow-up question :)
<stratochief>
so, the LEO shields aren't present for me, so they come from... DRE?
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<xShadowx>
imo move all to survivability :P
<SirKeplan>
i think this discussion came up a while back
<SirKeplan>
i thought they had been moved for some reason :P
<stratochief>
I do like them being two seperate nodes; IMO a heat shield for returning a fim bucket or Mercury capsule is a substantially different accomplishment than a lunar & human rated shield
<stratochief>
my accidental question earlier should have been "what mod am I missing", which is DRE I think
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<stratochief>
IIRC, soundnfury or xShadowx helped me test using the stock system to kill kerbals from over-G a few weeks ago, and found some decent values
<xShadowx>
wasnt me :P
<stratochief>
thankfully I was just able to dig them up. with those values we could just use the stock acceleration system to kill people, right? beyond that, and heat shield configs, is there anything DRE does that is necessary anymore?
<xShadowx>
stratochief: but both /are/ shields, and /are/ causing the payload, whatever it may be, to survive
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<stratochief>
xShadowx: I'm not disputing that all types of heatshields help with 'survivability' the concept, we're talking about tech node distribution :P
<stratochief>
I hope starwaster wouldn't be annoyed if we cover those functions without him having to keep updating a mod? opinions?
<xShadowx>
im with keepfit doing G stuff ;p but thats b/c of the longer lasting nature
<xShadowx>
stock has no sense of time, just a hard limit, so fakey
<stratochief>
xShadowx: not so; soundnfury and I were fiddling with the stock system a few weeks ago
<leudaimon>
stratochief and others, iirc the replacing of things in nodes was because not all LEO heatshields were in survivability, some were in an earlier construction node, don't recall which one exactly. I think it the one after that which unlocks survivability
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<stratochief>
SirKeplan: I'm reading your proposal on AltHistory for missions to a habitable Mars. I like your path :)
<stratochief>
*habitable Venus
<SirKeplan>
stratochief: ah cool :)
<SirKeplan>
i'm always interested in that sort of premise, having habitable planets in our system
<SirKeplan>
i haven't been following that TL much lately though
<stratochief>
I'm just reading old things from scratch, I'd bookmarked a few
<stratochief>
I still say that Mars is habitable 'enough'
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<SirKeplan>
you know, a tweaked RSS with a nice venus would be cool
<stratochief>
everybody is making new planets for KSP nowadays, will RSS join the party? :P
<stratochief>
but yeah, feel free to make one, I'd play with it :)
<stratochief>
I like how so many people in that TL thread are discussing a conservative plan, where they remote control rovers from flyby. why not aerobrake to landing, then just start planing and farming Earth plants?
<stratochief>
a habitable venus would be receptive to tons of different strategies
<stratochief>
I'd go with ISRU Mormon settlements
<SirKeplan>
Yeah that TL is much more conservative than i would expect if we actually had a 2nd earth type world
<SirKeplan>
Too much potential knowledge and profits to take it slow
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<stratochief>
yep, I agree. the world has 5-7 years from when they discover a habitable venus to probe it with small, unmanned things before they've got big launchers to start throwing people and supplies at it
<stratochief>
but how do you design a rover/lander for Venus, to taste if the plants are edible or humans? :P
<UmbralRaptor>
stratochief: Viking?
<UmbralRaptor>
Alternatively, bring a bunch of mass-specs?
<stratochief>
UmbralRaptor: not just searching for 'organic life', but seeing if earth life can eat it and survive
<stratochief>
maybe mice? dog? :P
<UmbralRaptor>
hrm
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<SirKeplan>
Don't bring earth animals, you might create a mass extinction event if they get loose