<zilti>
RealFuels would probably do that (which is part of RO). At least there's hydrogen boiloff.
<blowfish>
helium boil off? I didn't think helium was usually stored as a gas in spacecraft
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<soundnfury>
blowfish: it's often stored supercritically iirc
<soundnfury>
which means that there's no phase-change heat for boiloff to cool the rest
<soundnfury>
so you have all your helium at slowly rising temperature and pressure, until N hours after launch your burst disk ruptures, vents, and now you have no helium
<blowfish>
mmh
<blowfish>
so really you just have to use it or vent it
<blowfish>
though I guess that's true of cryogenic propellants too - the only reason to vent is to prevent the tank from overpressurizing
<stratochief>
helium is usually used as a pressurant. RO/RF doesn't really simulate pressurants
<stratochief>
if you had liquid helium to a tank, it'd probably boil. we just don't really use it in game
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<soundnfury>
stratochief: I think we support it as an RCS monoprop though (?)
* soundnfury
-> zzz
<stratochief>
soundnfury: didn't say we didn't, but I don't recall seeing liquid helium in there, and the original question was about boiloff
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<Probus>
Definitely supported as an RCS propellant. That's actually what sparked the question. Using it in a deep space probe.
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<egg|zzz|egg>
zilti: also as I said, reporting issues on master isn't very interesting, it's an ever-changing mess; the releases are much easier to work with.
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<stratochief>
o/
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<egg|zzz|egg>
zilti: ok good news, I can reproduce your thign
<egg|zzz|egg>
zilti: the key is to launch on the *trailing* hemisphere of Earth
<egg|zzz|egg>
(now to try to fix it I guess)
<zilti>
egg|zzz|egg: Hmm, so I basically had "bad luck" with my launches?
<egg|zzz|egg>
zilti: well, try launching at dawn
<egg|zzz|egg>
zilti: see if that works
<zilti>
egg|zzz|egg: Ok. Which would be roughly starting at which time? Until now I of course launched after "midnight", since the simulation starts then
<egg|zzz|egg>
if you launch in the evening, the gods of the night bounce your rocket off the atmosphere for a while and then lob you into deep space
<egg|zzz|egg>
zilti: press the warp-to-morning button, launch
<zilti>
egg|zzz|egg: I see. Thanks! I assume this is the case for every celestial in the system?
<egg|zzz|egg>
zilti: and use IRC to report your findings, it's more convenient than the issue
<egg|zzz|egg>
zilti: maybe? :-p
<zilti>
Heh :-P
<xShadowx>
but issies leave logs and records so egg can be lazy and not forget :P
<xShadowx>
issues*
* xShadowx
loves issues
* xShadowx
procrastinates a lot
* xShadowx
goes back to burning kerbals
<zilti>
Apropos issues. I kinda had to laugh when I found out Microsoft calls the project files in Visual Studio "Solutions"
<egg|zzz|egg>
what, should they call them problems?
<xShadowx>
? makes sense to me
<zilti>
What about "Project"?
<xShadowx>
it isnt using 'solution' as in 'answer to problem'
<zilti>
(Like every other IDE out there)
<xShadowx>
project is taken for the individual projects within a solution
<zilti>
That was all the rage a couple years back, like calling a "problem" not a "problem" but an "opportunity"
<egg|zzz|egg>
yuuup, trailing night side got me a huge boost too
<egg|zzz|egg>
makes a funny phase transition in the MJ graphs
<zilti>
xShadowx: What's your loading time, an hour? ^^
<xShadowx>
zilti: 3 minutes
<zilti>
You gotta be kidding me
<egg|zzz|egg>
hmm, memory-map the KSP directory? :-p
<zilti>
148 mods, SSD, and it loads for about 12 minutes
<egg|zzz|egg>
zilti: aaand leading night side goes fine
<egg|zzz|egg>
so it's the trailing side of the planet :D
<zilti>
egg|zzz|egg: Trailing side as in orbit-direction-wise?
<egg|zzz|egg>
yeah
<zilti>
This sounds like a work-intensive thing to hunt down and debug...
<egg|zzz|egg>
it's likely a wrong assumption of what KSP does :D
<egg|zzz|egg>
(everything is terrible)
<xShadowx>
zilti: you use mods as-is, i dont
<xShadowx>
also delete kspedia, even on sock its a nasty time drain ;p
<xShadowx>
stock*
<zilti>
Just delete the folder, or how...?
<Probus>
Nice idea xShadowx :)
<zilti>
Because if I think about it, I've used it about once for a mod
<xShadowx>
its in squad folder, ya
<zilti>
Well thanks, Squad...
<xShadowx>
its useful thing to read once, maybe keep a few critical pages if mods make nice ones with useful long term data
<egg|zzz|egg>
zilti: so, em, if you want to play with current master, avoid the demons of the evening I guess? :-p I'll look into it now
<zilti>
egg|zzz|egg: Will do :P thank you a lot!
<egg|zzz|egg>
Principia Cardano: now with Crepuscular Demons
<xShadowx>
nothing wrng with demons, make friends with em, you'll see em alot after you die
<zilti>
That's the spirit!
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<riocrokite>
xShadowx: was just looking for tips to decrease ksp loading times
<stratochief>
riocrokite: the only thing I find that makes it faster is when I don't modify any .cfgs between loads, it loads faster
<riocrokite>
I need a lean ksp version for mod and parts testing
<stratochief>
I wonder if my many CP cores help my load time somehow, since it never seems very long for me. or, I have a terrible sense of time perception
<stratochief>
riocrokite: yeah, absolutely. just the base mods that you NEED to get the necessary environment for testing something
<riocrokite>
deleting squad parts won't save me much, will it?
<stratochief>
no, I wouldn't think so. what minimum do you need for your testing? are you working with RSS/RF/RO?
<riocrokite>
lots of reloading so the shorter the better ;)
<riocrokite>
nope, dev version is strictly stock
<stratochief>
RCS build aid informs me that turning off the RCS on the Gemini adapter retrograde section will give me excellent balance during attitude changes
<stratochief>
riocrokite: are your changes made through MM patches? if so, you might just be able to rebuild the MM cache without restarting
<stratochief>
I used to use that from time to time for RO development. it was faster than restarting, just a bit inconsistent with the crazy pile of MM patches that is RO and everythign else
<zilti>
Hmm, my KSP doesn't like the CryoEngines, it refuses to finish loading with them...
<stratochief>
zilti: check if it came with its own MM patches or even version of MM that is messing with things
<zilti>
stratochief: I never install the MM that comes with mods, since I keep the mods I can updated with CKAN
<zilti>
Though in that particular case, that mod runs with neither CKAN nor manual install ^^
<zilti>
Eh, I have enough other parts to play with at the moment
<zilti>
Lol, I got the trial of RockSim and designed an actual model rocket during KSP loading. It's 158 cm, a weight I don't know, and carries 5kg of payload to about 13km altitude :P
<Probus>
I could never get scatterer or EVE working with RO. I'm sure it does. What am I doing wrong?
<zilti>
Probus: I just did that. So, of course "normal" installs of Scatterer and EVE, and then you need RVE (RealSolarSystem Visual Enhancements)
<riocrokite>
nah stratochief usually just testing only parts with different cfg so no mm involved
<Probus>
Using CKAN?
<zilti>
You won't find RVE on CKAN, but the other two you can install with CKAN, yes
<Probus>
Ah ha!
<zilti>
fyi, you're looking for RSSVE-1.2.2.1622-RC3.zip on GitHub.
<zilti>
That's what I "hate" about mods not on CKAN - with a bit of bad luck, you find yourself hunting down the most recent version through half a dozen forum threads
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<xShadowx>
riocrokite: i have 2 for testing, 1st is empty (not even squasd folder) just req dll/parts to test startup / read log for loading stuff, afterall dont need all of TACLS to test LS applying to my new part and 2nd is squad folder and just mods interacting with what i add for flight tests
<xShadowx>
ksp starts instantly with empty gamedata ;3
<stratochief>
5.5 minutes of terror: Titan II to orbit
<riocrokite>
yah xShadowx
<stratochief>
zilti: if you figure out all the jazz required to get RSSVE to be in CKAN, and working consistently, all the power to you :)
<riocrokite>
xShadowx: what are required files in squad folder xShadowx ?
<zilti>
stratochief: well, at first I'd have to know where to find the actually most recent version - it looks rather unmaintained at the moment...
<xShadowx>
riocrokite: 'required' depends on what you wanna do, nothing is really 'required' but itll remove contracts, agencies, tech tree, catalog, etc if you do full wipe, just parts/kspedia folder prolly covers 95% of it though
<stratochief>
wouldn't 1.2.2.1622-RC3 be the most recent, like you said?
<riocrokite>
yah true
<zilti>
stratochief: That's the most recent I've found. But it's from last summer, and in the thread there was mention of an "inofficial" patch where the link was dead
<zilti>
Also some devs seem to be rather hostile towards CKAN?
<xShadowx>
riocrokite: internals/props fairly pointless if you wont be using iva
<xShadowx>
but they load quick
<riocrokite>
k
<xShadowx>
just understand you are gutting stock ;p so if stuff missing, you know why heh
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<stratochief>
zilti: some? like, some specifically from RSSVE?
<xShadowx>
riocrokite: also theres a mod, forget name, skips start menu, goes start to loaded game
<riocrokite>
quick start, i'm using it
<xShadowx>
:)
<zilti>
stratochief: No, not that I know - but I've seen some mod posts with rather hostile stuff like "If you've downloaded my mod via CKAN, don't even think about asking me when you find a problem"
<xShadowx>
^ cuz ckan isnt perfect
<stratochief>
zilti: my feeling is that hostility against CKAN is aimed at people requesting that the mod maker add CKAN support, not against the idea of CKAN itself. I think nearly ever mod maker would love having a go-to CKAN person to manage the CKAN side of things
* xShadowx
agrees
<stratochief>
zilti: yeah, fair enough. I think that bit of hostility is towards users who don't follow the "So, you're thinking of asking for support?" guide, which includes making sure CKAN isn't the source of the problem before asking others for help
<egg|zzz|egg>
stratochief: there's also the history of CKAN, which at some point had some rather acrimonious relations with modders
<egg|zzz|egg>
to say the least
<xShadowx>
biggest ckan hate is usually ckan breaks the install process, be it wrong version matching etc (stuff happens, no installer can be perfect), dev doesnt want it on ckan, people try to smneak it on, users use it, stuff borked, user refuses to admit he uses ckan due to lack of support if admitting
<Probus>
Thanks zilti
<xShadowx>
ya ckan policy of "list it regardless of what modder says cuz we can so eff yew haha" o.o
<egg|zzz|egg>
xShadowx: it was that; now it's not that anymore
<egg|zzz|egg>
iirc
<xShadowx>
yar
<stratochief>
most users on the forum who ask for help don't even give enough detail about their problem for me to tell whether they used CKAN to get there; just "everthin borked. pls hlp"
<xShadowx>
stratochief: bu its borked i need halp
<stratochief>
well, that probably isn't the majority, just the ones that stick in my memory, or the ones who demand help from me in youtube video comments, then downvote the video an hour later whether I respond helpfully or not :P
<stratochief>
xShadowx: damn, sounds like you dun goofed. good luck with that, bro
<xShadowx>
stratochief: wow thats rude, pesky impatient people -.- atleast i downvoted you for legit reasons - you werent pretty enough :P
<xShadowx>
jk
<stratochief>
I use sexy rockets, I steal them from FASA, Schnobs, or RN :)
<xShadowx>
i never said rockets werent sexy ;3
<xShadowx>
though did you get amars colony going yet?
* xShadowx
likes colonies more
<stratochief>
I'll never have a colony, but I'm closer to carrying out Mars Direct
<stratochief>
and also close to spending over a month on the Moon, that is almost a base
<zilti>
stratochief: So, pull request to put RSSVE on CKAN is done :P
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<stratochief>
zilti: I'm uncertain of the mechanics of CKAN, won't you have to ensure that CKAN grabs the compatible version of EVE and Scatterer as well?
<zilti>
Right now I'm trying to get my KSP to work again :\
<Probus>
I feel your pain :)
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<egg|zzz|egg>
zilti: I have a fix for the crepuscular demons, but it causes me to ignore thrust when in space... does that count as a fix :-p
<zilti>
egg|zzz|egg: Soo, no way to accelerate in space? :P
<egg|zzz|egg>
:-p
<egg|zzz|egg>
I think the crepuscular demons are due to picking up velocities in the rotating reference frame and interpreting them in the nonrotating reference frame, fwiw
<egg|zzz|egg>
not that it helps much to know that :-p
<zilti>
egg|zzz|egg: Well, and especially due to when the rocket exits the atmosphere and is slower than the planet on its orbit, it gets caught again by the atmosphere?
<zilti>
I also remember that it puts ridiculous g-forces onto the rocket. The first time I tried the mod, I had to uninstall another one that destructed vessels under too high g-forces. Only to find out that that didn't help ^^
<xShadowx>
g forces is a side effect of the sudden acceleration?:)