<ThisDay>
April 18: Block I Apollo CSM numbers 007 and 011 are delivered to NASA in 1966. The first Falcon 9, carrying CRS-3, flies with landing legs and successfuly demonstrates the possibility of a stable landing by "landing" vertically on the ocean in 2013.
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<UmbralRaptor>
2
<UmbralRaptor>
er
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<NathanKell>
o/
<Qboid>
NathanKell: blowfish left a message for you in #RO [17.04.2017 02:17:10]: "I released a new version of SolverEngines, mind updating the OP when you get a chance?"
<rsparkyc>
\o NathanKell
<blowfish>
evening NathanKell
<NathanKell>
Evenin'!
<NathanKell>
ohgod you and strato made me do it and now I have 31 notifies and 12 PMs
<blowfish>
12 PMs? From who?
<NathanKell>
I haven't been on the forum in like 3 months
<NathanKell>
but mostly YANFRET PMing me as if I were still a moderator :]
<xShadowx>
o/
<rsparkyc>
oh yeah, i guess i did leave you a note there
<xShadowx>
could be worse
<NathanKell>
blowfish: I just edit the title to say 1.2, yes?
<NathanKell>
rsparkyc no worries, and sorry I didn't get back to you on there :]
<xShadowx>
qboid could be tied into forums and spam you in irc ;p
<rsparkyc>
ha, no problem, you were busy :)
<blowfish>
yeah, thanks! I guess there's not nearly as much info in that OP as others
<NathanKell>
A while before I left I changed all my OPs to just have a link to Github/releases/latest for the download, and /releases/ for the changelog, so I didn't have to edit the text :D
<xShadowx>
Thomas: why isnt the almighty qboid tied into forums to deliver forum notifications into irc :P
<rsparkyc>
haha
<xShadowx>
NathanKell: thats cheating
<NathanKell>
blowfish does that mean I need to update RF too?
<NathanKell>
Since Solver got updated
<NathanKell>
the RF OP I mean
<blowfish>
nope, Starwaster still wants to add some stuff before release
<blowfish>
no breaking changes in this solver release
<NathanKell>
ok
<blowfish>
and I didn't change the assembly version
<blowfish>
(did change the file version and KSPAssembly version since those should be safe)
<NathanKell>
btw y'all are welcome to email me at nathankell@gmail.com if I'm not IRC-reachable
<NathanKell>
since it's firewalled at work now
<NathanKell>
well, s/now/always/ but old job was work at home :P
<Starwaster>
Yeah, trying to finally get proper analytical support in MFT boiloff
<NathanKell>
wooooooooot!
<NathanKell>
:)
<rsparkyc>
you could always set up an AWS ELB to port redirect for you...
<NathanKell>
I mean, really what I'd do is VNC in to my desktop
<NathanKell>
it's what I always did from my laptop rather than installing a client
<rsparkyc>
that works too
<xShadowx>
who the frak firewalls irc o.o
<NathanKell>
Heck, _hangouts_ was firewalled for a bit :P
<NathanKell>
we're very security conscious
<xShadowx>
try discord, its new enough it might not be firewalled :P
<xShadowx>
and discord is replacing most chat systems
<rsparkyc>
anyone know how long i can expect to be able to hang out at L1?
<xShadowx>
people are too paranoid nowadays
<NathanKell>
0?
<NathanKell>
It's not stable, so 0.
<NathanKell>
(you'll need to station-keep)
<xShadowx>
get pincipia and go camp at L4/5 :D
<rsparkyc>
yeah, finally got pincipia working on osx
<rsparkyc>
so i'm trying it out for the first time today
<NathanKell>
\o/
<rsparkyc>
i know it's unstable
<xShadowx>
NathanKell: you hear principia has axial tilt now?;3
<NathanKell>
which reminds me egg|zzz|egg egg|zzz|egg egg|zzz|egg poooooke <3
<NathanKell>
xShadowx yeah!
<rsparkyc>
but trying to figure out how long i can go between station keeping
<NathanKell>
ah, that I don't know. I guess it's a question of how much of a displacement you're willing to accept
<rsparkyc>
lamont got it working, and put up a temp release
<NathanKell>
(also I'm not sure if the cost is linear)
<rsparkyc>
i can get about 1/2 to 1 orbit around the larger body before i really start moving
<lamont>
i accidentally left principia running while i went on vacation and camped out at L5 for over a week...
<xShadowx>
NathanKell: which lovely dev was it that moved kerbals out to a cfg?;3
<NathanKell>
Hi pal :)
<NathanKell>
I had to do a lot of hijinks (and a bit of a rewrite of GameDatabase) to do that :]
<xShadowx>
that thing has saved me a ton on adding partmodules to kerbals :D
<NathanKell>
:)
<xShadowx>
i had evil idea im tryin to test atm, since a kerbal on eva is a vessel, im hopin i can add an internal to the kerbal part XD
<xShadowx>
ima laugh if this accually works
<NathanKell>
Aw, quite, OhioBob PM'd me with a request to change the temperature code. I think he missed Squexit.
<NathanKell>
cute*
<xShadowx>
squexit?o.O
<xShadowx>
exodus?:P
<NathanKell>
Squexodus you mean?
<xShadowx>
lolz
<xShadowx>
it doesnt seem as happy around here after all the adults left ;\
* xShadowx
is happy mods last forever
<xShadowx>
and sadly, iva on kerbal part doesnt work, or atleast wont switch into it, time to get hacky :D
<blowfish>
there's some reasonably interesting stuff coming in 1.3, even if you don't care about localization
<blowfish>
they're still active
<blowfish>
and Squad still has talent, even if it's stretched thinner than before
<NathanKell>
Trigger and JPLRepo rock, yeah, and I never had a bad interaction with Roy although I'm not sure if he's even still there. The QA guys are awesome too obvs.
<JPLRepo>
Wait.. woh. ho. My ears a tingling. ;p
<xShadowx>
what interesting besides loc+bugfixes? when i went through changelogs i dont remember anything else ;x
* xShadowx
needs big red flashy sign
<blowfish>
localization tracker is public, yeah?
<xShadowx>
JPL/trigger dont count as squad though, they're modders at heart :P
<JPLRepo>
no it's not blowfish
<JPLRepo>
that's Experimental team talk
<JPLRepo>
PreRelease is the public tracker
<rsparkyc>
ok, off to bed, gnight all
<xShadowx>
\o
<rsparkyc>
nice seeing you around again NathanKell
<NathanKell>
thanks! <3
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<JPLRepo>
to answer the question anyway xShadowx there is some modders stuff etc coming/not quite documented yet.
<JPLRepo>
But yes 1.3 is mostly about bugs and localisation.
<xShadowx>
NathanKell: you should continue your series, all the way to a mars colony ;)
<ThisDay>
April 18: Block I Apollo CSM numbers 007 and 011 are delivered to NASA in 1966. The first Falcon 9, carrying CRS-3, flies with landing legs and successfuly demonstrates the possibility of a stable landing by "landing" vertically on the ocean in 2013.
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<Rokker>
ferram4: oi, you on, its nothing mod important, so if ur not really free, ignore this
<Rokker>
its just something cool i think you would like
<Qboid>
Rokker: I'll redirect this as soon as they are around.
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<zilti>
Ok, so AmpYear and RealismOverhaul are incompatible with each other.
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<stratochief>
zilti: how so? I haven't tried AmpYear in 1.2.2 , but I think I used that in 1.1.3 but I oculd be misremembering
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<zilti>
stratochief: It's very weird. As soon as both are installed, I noticed two things: 1. upon startup, I don't get the scatterer window and - as deal breaker - 2. many items are missing in the hangars, like e.g. the Mk1 pod.
<zilti>
As soon as either is removed, it's back to normal again.
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<stratochief>
lol. interesting break. it'd be nice to have a reliable mod that provides info about battery, power production and consumption. but generally, I just throw my payload in orbit and observe it for a bit, tick down a few numbers myself
<xShadowx|2>
zilti: 2 is likely an MM issue and just not configured for RO, not incompatible? as for 1, i remember nothing in it that wouldve conflicted with scatterer, curious for more data ;3
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<xShadowx|2>
and scatterer is obviously the deal breaker, you crazy
<stratochief>
that JeeF guy... seems like a sensitive one. That said, they are trying to improve/create/tweak jet engine plumes, which is laudable
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<gazpachian>
@stratochief Are you on 1.1.3 or 1.2.x? Cause fusebox exists for the latter, which is basically ampyear without the bloat and parts: http://forum.kerbalspaceprogram.com/index.php?/topic/157896-122-fusebox-continued-electric-charge-tracker-and-build-helper/
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<xShadowx|2>
fusebox was also in 1.1 wasnt it?
<xShadowx|2>
thought that came out quite a while ago
<gazpachian>
I don't think so, the original dev thread only goes to 1.0.5 before ratzap discontinued development
<gazpachian>
linuxgurugamer resurrected it as he is wont to do
<xShadowx|2>
ah so is old, just skiped a vers
<gazpachian>
Well, three to be exact, the ones with performant stable RO releases to boot. :P
<gazpachian>
Okay, four, but didn't 1.1.1 only last like a weekend or so?
<xShadowx|2>
i tend to ignore 3rd digit, its mostly fine tuning/bugfixin and usually doesnt break anything :P
<gazpachian>
Then you've been far luckier than I have. :)
<stratochief>
gazpachian: good point. fusebox might have been what I have used before
<stratochief>
zilti: ^
<zilti>
stratochief: Jup, am using Fusebox now :)
* xShadowx|2
tries fusebox
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<stratochief>
o/ JeeF
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<Probus>
Work at home sure is nice.
<xShadowx|2>
my mom works for netflix, 16 hour days, they dont send her paychecks though for some reason
<gazpachian>
As a content reviewer I take it?
<xShadowx|2>
self proclaimed :P
<xShadowx|2>
but ya workin at home is nice, flexible time, for programmers its lovely, i can screw off all day as long as i get my work done eventually lol
<Probus>
USAF xShadowx
<xShadowx|2>
for you?
<xShadowx|2>
do they give you discount on flying toys?
<xShadowx|2>
and navy pilots > airforce pilots :P
<xShadowx|2>
Probus: any surplus F-14s?;3
<xShadowx|2>
pepsi shoulda stuck to their advertising and gave the harrier jet like they claimed
<xShadowx|2>
pepsi accually got sued over it, the guy wanted it :P
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<JeeF>
Anybody alive in here?
<JeeF>
Could use a hand
<rsparkyc>
i'm alive
<rsparkyc>
stratochief: you actually back from vacation this time?
<JeeF>
Been working on the J58 afterburner plume with smokescreen and cfg files for the past two days, wasn't happy with the orange one. I got to this point, give me your honest opinion https://youtu.be/mooDXu7XqL0
<JeeF>
I have all the values saved, now I just need to know the steps to translate those values into cfg files without making every single hydrolox flame from other parts to look like that
<rsparkyc>
i feel like it's weird that you see shock diamonds before the rest of the plume
<rsparkyc>
or perhaps they should just be less intense when there is no other plume effects going on
<JeeF>
I may be way off the mark here, but I can swear I've seen before just before you can see the afterburner flames to just start seeing the shock diamonds, but I could be wrong
<JeeF>
Sadly I don't know how to make them... "fade in"
<rsparkyc>
i suppose that has less afterburner effects and more shock diamonds
<rsparkyc>
but they're not as pronounced as yours
<JeeF>
you start seeing them around 75% thrust and about 85% you get the blue afterburner flame
<JeeF>
yeah, agreed
<JeeF>
still a lot of fine-tuning required
<rsparkyc>
yeah, i haven't done much plume configuration, so i don't know how to put those into a cfg
<rsparkyc>
other than that i think it looks pretty good
<JeeF>
=)
<stratochief>
yep rsparkyc
<rsparkyc>
welcome back
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<rsparkyc>
i got principia installed on my mac finally :)
<JeeF>
I'll keep digging by myself here and will keep an eye in here if someone extends a hand
<rsparkyc>
cool, best thing to do is probably reverse engineer what other people have done
<stratochief>
JeeF: looks really good! first, note down every single value you set to obtain that effect. baking it to a config can take some doing, but at least it is all down outside of game
<JeeF>
Another problem is I completely lost the jet sound effect when I changed the prefab plume
<JeeF>
yes, I have each individually saved into txt
<stratochief>
did you have to change the .mu of something else to get that effect, or no?
<stratochief>
rsparkyc: I did some play with principia this weekend as well. I did alright with Kerbin-Mun L points, but didn't have luck hitting Moho with a hoffman transfer
<stratochief>
JeeF: ^
<JeeF>
on RealismOverhaul\RealPlume_Configs\Squad\turbofanengine.cfg, changed Plume name to Hydrolox-Lower. That didn't do anything in game. Then on the same file I also changed the %powerEffectName and %spoolEffectName both to Hydrolox-Lower, and then if finally worked, but that's when I lost the jet engine sound. I'm confused.
<JeeF>
Other than that, just fine-tuning values in game with smokescreen
<JeeF>
no .mu changes
<stratochief>
I'm guessing %spool is related to the sound. you learn more things for certain when you change one at a time :P
<stratochief>
changing lots at once falls into the "1 bug fixed, 2 new bugs" meme hole
<JeeF>
Yeah I know, but that was pretty much my last hurrah, I was about to give up, having spent endless hours fiddling with cfg files and 15min wait on ksp loading times to see absolutely nothing in game
<JeeF>
But that last attempt got it working so it kinda bumped up my strenghts =)
<JeeF>
not giving up just yet
<stratochief>
yeah, I hear you. I had that issue with thermal/boiloff stuff lots of times. changed tons of things tons of times, didn't see any improvement in game, so I gave up for a bit. rinse repeat.
<stratochief>
that's why rsparkyc suggested to 'reverse engineer' existing configs. ie. look at how they set things, what effect that has, so you can learn the levers you can pull yourself in saving your own custom config
<rsparkyc>
stratochief: hoffman transfer?
<JeeF>
What was driving me mad was the fact I was following guidelines and videos (like yours) and doing it exactly as it was stated, but nothing was changing in game. I even changed the dds like I told ya, got nothing. I was starting to think I was editing another ksp install folder, lol
<rsparkyc>
either there's a joke there, or you meant hohmann transfer
<stratochief>
since the hydrolox effect doesn't have mach diamonds (I don't think) perhaps you've got a jet effect and hydrolox effect going at the same time?
<stratochief>
rsparkyc: no joke, I'm a superdoubleplusgood speller :P
<rsparkyc>
lol
<JeeF>
I'll give you a screenshot, 1 moment
<rsparkyc>
i just got to the sun-kerbin L1
<rsparkyc>
want to see if i can do an easy transfer to L2
<stratochief>
JeeF: the RealPlume example config should help show you where to save the values in your config. if you changed values (in game) other than those, getting them in the config will be a bit more challenging, but gradually doable
<JeeF>
http://imgur.com/a/Cg58k as you can see on the left-hand side, hydrolox-lower SHOCKCONE and FLARE did most of the trick. For red I mostly turned it off, and for blue there was a lot of tuning involved as well. I didn't touch grey
<JeeF>
I wouldn't be surprised if I managed to do about 2 dozen wrong things in the process, lol
<JeeF>
but hey, I have the values and I'm holding them tight
<JeeF>
getting to those values alone was a 2h task
<JeeF>
one is perfect, but change another and the first one is no longer ok
<stratochief>
that dialog will show all the effects for each engine; can you redo that screenshot with only 1 engine on the craft?
<JeeF>
yeah sure
<stratochief>
also, what is the file that contains the plume for that engine initially?
<stratochief>
hmm, interesting. from that, I'd expect all the jet effects to have gone away
<stratochief>
you can change the %spool bit back as it was, I'm pretty sure. that may bring the sound back
<stratochief>
JeeF: have you lookeda t your ModuleManager.ConfigCache? it will show all the code attached to each part when the game boots. so, it won't show your in-game changes, but it should give you an idea of what all the effects code attached to that jet engine looks like to start
<stratochief>
hmm. yeah, I wouldn't expect the effects code from AJE to be kicking in (although you'd know by having seen the config cache) since it says NEEDS[!RealPlume
<JeeF>
I must have about 50 github tabs open on chrome, lol
<stratochief>
as in "don't do this if RealPlume is present"
<JeeF>
Its certainly confusing
<stratochief>
yeah, there is a lot to learn, a lot to hold in mind at once
<JeeF>
This is why I was thinking that perhaps creating a new part from scratch, new code, etc, would be easier
<JeeF>
Cos at this point I don't know what is calling what and why
<JeeF>
And I don't even know if the code is alright
<JeeF>
What do you think?
<stratochief>
there is generally a good reason that configs are done the way they are. ultimately it saves on redundant work and is easier than the clean sheet alternative
<stratochief>
the alternative to invoking and modifying a plume prefab, is to create this from scratch: v
<stratochief>
it also disagrees on localPosition; *shrug*
<JeeF>
this is starting to feel like a bad prank, lmao
<JeeF>
I'm going mental here
<JeeF>
I'll take a breather
<stratochief>
s/prank/codingasusual
<stratochief>
you've got the tools, you've learned a bit about them. try to make small changes when you're done breather-ing
<stratochief>
GL, HF
<gazpachian>
Jeef: Add your gamedata folder to the windows search index so you can search by file contents. It should then be fairly easy to find the MM patch responsible when you search for the part name
<JeeF>
done that about 2 years ago XD
<gazpachian>
Alright then, I'm fresh out of good advice!
<JeeF>
the intention is what counts, thank you =)
<xShadowx|2>
so my uncle claims a civilization cannot goto other stars, until it first solves all social problems, which in turn will mean any civilization we meet will be peaceful and there will never be conflicts
<xShadowx|2>
ie nobody is ever going to invade us :P
<gazpachian>
Realplume doesn't care about part scaling, does it?
<JeeF>
RATS! If I knew about smokescreen before I made this video it would've been much better
<JeeF>
those F1s with tiny plume looks pathetic
<gazpachian>
pfft, it's just that the plume is underexpanded, clearly working as intended!
<JeeF>
=P
<gazpachian>
but back to the thrust transform, what if you set the values to those desired with a :FINAL MM patch?
<JeeF>
It's a very nice workaround... as soon as I learn how to code a :Final MM patch
<gazpachian>
@PART[Partname]:FINAL { // Your changes between these brackets}
<JeeF>
all good and dandy, but whatever goes in "your changes between these brackets" I wouldn't know where to start
<JeeF>
I can read code and understand what it does, but I can't write code
<gazpachian>
ah, there's a hurdle! :P
<JeeF>
I'd have to find something very similar and reverse-engineer
<gazpachian>
I mean, if you send me the original part file and the file with the desired values I'll make a patch for you
<JeeF>
Well, that solves my problem... but not really ideal if we want to share the tweaks to other users, right
<gazpachian>
No guarantees that's where the solutions to all your problems lie, but it's a start. :D
<gazpachian>
well, you'd only have to provide the patch for other people to download and it should work for them as well
<gazpachian>
the J58 comes with AJE by default, right_
<JeeF>
to be honest, what I would really like to see is these changes implemented as part of the RO package. But who should I talk to about it? AJE owner? RealPlume owner? RO owner?
<JeeF>
lol, I've no clu
<JeeF>
e
<JeeF>
I think so, yeah
<JeeF>
but it does have blue afterburner flames on AJE without RO/RP
<JeeF>
according to blowfish
<Probus>
What's the name of that mod that gives you 4 lighted towers around the launch pad.
<gazpachian>
Well, RO rescales the engine I assume? So if you tweak the plume for the rescaled version of the engine the config would be better at home in RO I suppose
<gazpachian>
Probus: KSC floodlight, you need Kerbal Konstructs as well to make it work
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<github>
[RealismOverhaul] raidernick opened pull request #1600: RN zenit 3 part adds (master...master) https://git.io/vSAXh
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<JeeF>
@stratochief I'll make an account on github. So, just to confirm I got this right, I write up a cfg file like gazpachian suggested, open a pull request (once I learn how to do that, XD) and paste the cfg I just made in there, correct?
<stratochief>
yep
<JeeF>
whats the trick to get your name red?
<xShadowx|2>
in irc? be op
<xShadowx|2>
type /part <name> to set yourself op
<xShadowx|2>
for github, make account > goto repo > click fork > you now have a yourname/reponame for your own fork > add a file where you want with stuff > click pull request
<gazpachian>
So what's the deal with RSSVE reverting any changes I make to the provided scatterer config files I wonder.
<gazpachian>
Has anyone run into an issue like that? Is there any cache I need to delete before making permanent changes to scatterer configs?
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<gazpachian>
alright, never mind. You have to manually copy some binaries around. Would help if I could read for once!