Deddly changed the topic of #KSPOfficial to: Kerbal Space Program official channel | versions: KSP1 1.12 bit.ly/ksp112update | Rules: tinyurl.com/KSP-Rules | "modcall" to call ops | Δv maps: https://i.imgur.com/CHVnEeE.pnghttps://i.imgur.com/gBoLsSt.png | https://forum.kerbalspaceprogram.com/index.php?/topic/203227-kerbal-space-program-112-on-final-approach-is-now-available/ Got bugs? Verify files on Steam for instant happiness.
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<Solar_Oracle>
Alright, hopefully today I'll find out what John Ringo constitutes an effective space navy. BadScience incoming!
<Solar_Oracle>
For Heaven's sake, Ringo, we don't need an extended explanation of military citations!
<Solar_Oracle>
Even the Mass Effect codex wasn't this detailed!
<raptop>
hah
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<Solar_Oracle>
This is reallllllly tedious.
<Solar_Oracle>
And this is a short chapter, too.
<umaxtu>
Solar_Oracle, you like vampires?
<Solar_Oracle>
I like killing them in Warhammer 2.
<Solar_Oracle>
And I like watching them die in Blade.
<Solar_Oracle>
I'm afraid David Weber's too good a author for me to cover.
<Solar_Oracle>
As part of my community service requirements, I have to read bad books.
<umaxtu>
oh, you're purposely looking for bad books
<Solar_Oracle>
Sadly, yes. I feel . . . empty insidew
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<Solar_Oracle>
Chapter 2 complete.
<Solar_Oracle>
I think we're in for our first discussion of humanity's first spacegoing warships.
<umaxtu>
does an ICBM count?
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<Solar_Oracle>
That'd probably be better than what we're about to get.
<TwistenX>
What's everyone talking about?
* Solar_Oracle
mumbles something about exposition being the crutch on which lesser writers build worlds.
<Solar_Oracle>
I'm reading an awful book and writing a detailed review of it.
<umaxtu>
and I'm trying to get him to save his sanity by reading slightly less terrible books
<TwistenX>
Why would you read it if it's awful?
<Solar_Oracle>
Because it's my internet job.
<Solar_Oracle>
Also, it is legit fun being snarky.
<TwistenX>
Oh. Why are you on the Kerbal Space Program IRC Chat if your internet job is writing reviews on books unless KSP is just a hobby?
<Solar_Oracle>
Because it's a bad science fiction book, and #KSPOfficial is my home base on IRC.
<Solar_Oracle>
And no one here normally discusses anything. It's Idle Relay Chat, after all.
<TwistenX>
I try to start conversations and discussions, but sometimes, people just avoid it or there's not enough people online.
<Solar_Oracle>
Few people actually use IRC for discussion. This is also true with most Discords.
<TwistenX>
I don't have Discord, so I wouldn't really know that.
<Solar_Oracle>
Great Odin's Raven, the Posleen don't even bother aiming their guns!
<Solar_Oracle>
So they can use guns, but they can't AIM!?
<TwistenX>
Bots in shooter games be like:
<umaxtu>
or me
<umaxtu>
I can't aim
<raptop>
no one can AIM. It's been shut down for years
<TwistenX>
I have had a significant improvement in self-esteem in KSP.
<raptop>
Also, why would the Polseen not aim their guns? o_O
<Solar_Oracle>
I believe that they're actually designed to be incredibly stupid, despite the fact that they're armed with sophisticated mass driver weapons capable of firing at such a rate that they sever human limbs.
<TwistenX>
I've been practicing docking vessels in Spaceflight Simulator, and it was MUCH easier than I figured it would be. With most docking attempts now, I rarely quicksave because I've practiced so much. I've even made a Space Station and I'm making one in my current save file.
<Solar_Oracle>
They're just really, really, unbelievably dumb.
<Solar_Oracle>
Chapter 3 complete.
<minas_tirith>
Did she have the differential equations stream?
<Solar_Oracle>
I was expecting Ringo to be a little better than Kratman, but I'm experiencing some serious disappointment here.
<Solar_Oracle>
Wait, Minas_tirith speaks?
<Solar_Oracle>
I though the Witch King of Agmar finally took you!
<minas_tirith>
Solar_Oracle, why?
<TwistenX>
Is there lore or something to people in this IRC Chat
<TwistenX>
The only lore I have is that I started the Imperial vs. Metric Systems War a while ago.
<raptop>
minas_tirith: I mean, have you seen what the nazghûl have gotten up to lately?
<Solar_Oracle>
I can come up with lore if you want?
<minas_tirith>
raptop, nazgul are good boys
<TwistenX>
since i've been here, the only lore that raptop would have is they died, undied but were still dead, died again, came back alive, died for the third time, undied but was still dead again, and here we are in the present, and raptop is alive again
<Solar_Oracle>
Raptop's been around since the Cretaceous period.
<TwistenX>
I know, but that's what happened ever since I joined the IRC Chat
<Deddly>
OK so darsie's slow camera movement is not because of mods. Thanks!
<Deddly>
Also, filed need to be verified because Steam is absolutely terrible at this.
<Deddly>
files*
<Deddly>
Nothing to do with HD failures
<Deddly>
If I had a penny for every bug that got fixed by just validating files... I'd have at least enough for a box of prawn cocktail flavoured Pringles.
<Truga>
is it still possible to land on minmus on a single jetpack?
<Truga>
land and get back again*
<Truga>
cause yeah always do that if you can, it's good fun :p
<darsie>
Truga: Minmus orbit is 150 m/s or so. Jetpack is 600 m/s. So, sure :).
<darsie>
I'm doing it :).
<Truga>
for some reason i had in my head that jetpacks got nerfed at some point but i guess not
<Truga>
hehe
<darsie>
Maybe the dv now depends on what you carry.
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<Truga>
when i last did it kerbals only had flags :v
<darsie>
jetpack and chute
<raptop>
jetpacks and parachutes (...and in-cabin kerbals) have mass now
<raptop>
hrm, not sure if EVA kerbals vary in mass. probably
<Deddly>
They should
* underwater_bees
cancel Deddly
Deddly is now known as ___
<Althego>
what a name
* ___
is cancelled
* raptop
assumes that Deddly is a stamp then
<___>
___
<flayer>
...
<Althego>
lol
<darsie>
.
<darsie>
Is it normal that the HECS doesn't have auto hibernate in warp?
<darsie>
Like, a new feature? :)
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<darsie>
Hmm, not enough dv. Need to make a Mun gravity assist :).
<raptop>
oh no
<___>
Don't all probes have auto hibernate?
<___>
But it's a setting, if I recall correctly.
<___>
You have to have it turned on in advanced tweakables.
<Althego>
yes, it is off by default, cant understand why
<flayer>
to make you suffer
<Althego>
why are we here?
<raptop>
presumably for reasons related to why the default throttle was 50% for ages and is 0% now
<___>
I think having it off can teach something
<darsie>
No, it's not even available.
<___>
darsie, do you have advanced tweakables turned on?
<darsie>
no ...
<___>
___
<Althego>
always have it on
<___>
<___> You have to have it turned on in advanced tweakables.
<darsie>
Make it default? :)
<Althego>
the advanced tweakables will be with you, always
<Althego>
because advanced tweakables are also not on by default
* raptop
assumes that flayer lives in the flayer jungle
<flayer>
the gidbinn is mine!!
<raptop>
hah
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<Althego>
kikkerikii
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<TwistenX>
Have you guys seen the newest KSP2 video?
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<Althego>
hehe ihavent
<Althego>
but quit already
<Althego>
i hope there is at least one not random generated easter egg on eve now
<Althego>
oh probably not. the new ones are in the wiki alreadt
<Mat2ch>
I have seen the video. Looks nice. But unless I see a 1000 parts mega ship flying with 60 fps on a regular computer, I'm not impressed!
* raptop
wonders if the names (explodium sea, etc) count as easter eggs
* raptop
's opinion of KSP2 remains "mostly ignore it. It could be cool, but could end up being bad and in any case has been delayed multiple years and may be delayed more."
<Izaya>
we may have KSP2 eventually, but we have KSP1 now
<raptop>
yeah
<packbart>
at least they did let go of KSP 1 after 10 years. I'm not convinced, though, that developing KSP 2 was a good idea
<TwistenX>
My internet went out, so I'm gonna re-ask this question so I can see people's answers. Has anybody seen the newest KSP2 Show-and-Tell video on the KSP YouTube Channel?
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<Althego>
the one few hours ago? since then i watched it
<albertf>
Hi do you know if the new Maneuver Creation App works in career mode? I can see it in sandbox but not career.
<Althego>
havent tried it there, probably requires building upgrade
<albertf>
That's what I am thinking. Probably tracking?
<TwistenX>
I haven't gotten v1.12 yet because I play Enhanced Edition on Xbox One.
<raptop>
*sad trombone*
* TwistenX
cries in Console
<raptop>
unsure, but probably tracking station
<albertf>
Thanks Anyway. I will try a couple of upgrades and see. Thanks All - Bye
<TwistenX>
See ya
<TwistenX>
The Mun and Pol look very beautiful in the newest KSP2 video. It makes them look much realistic. I also like how the Mun also has Munar Seas now.
<albertf>
OK I tried it. Upgrading the Tracking did the trick.
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<TwistenX>
Cool. Now when Console KSP gets updated to 1.12 in 5 years, I'll know that I have to upgrade my tracking station if I play career mode.
<Solar_Oracle>
It has been done. The first four, or five, chapters are up.
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<TwistenX>
Have they figured out how to aim their guns yet?
<Solar_Oracle>
No, the Posleen are genetically engineered to not know how to do anything unless the plot demands it.
<Solar_Oracle>
For example: They don't know how to cross rivers with anything but bridges.
<Solar_Oracle>
I'm not even making that one up.
<TwistenX>
They're kinda similar to stormtroopers. They are only useful when killing a side character
<Solar_Oracle>
Stormtroopers actually have things like armor and air support.
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<Solar_Oracle>
The Posleen get one open-topped command vehicle for every few thousand rank and file. That's it.
<Solar_Oracle>
Unfortunately, the only place I could find to upload this for free also has a, uhm, rather inappropriate name for this channel and I'll have to seek permission.
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<TwistenX>
Dang. I think the agency or whatever they work for ran out of funding.
<TwistenX>
Say the channel name but modify it so it's not as inappropriate.
<TwistenX>
I think I've seen a video from Matt Lowne with a similar title, but I'm not sure
<Althego>
as anything with rand space plans... we shall see
<Althego>
grand
<TwistenX>
I'm pretty sure SpaceX's Super Heavy is also gonna have a test launch soon, too.
<Althego>
soon tm
<Althego>
what i dont get, how do they intend to launch from there?
<Althego>
with all those engines it is just too loud
<TwistenX>
From where?
<Solar_Oracle>
Very Carefully.
<Solar_Oracle>
I think they're hashing out issues with the FAA.
<Althego>
i doubt fass can solve this
<Althego>
the tower is already almost complete
<Althego>
but suppsoedly it will eb too loud to launch from there
<TwistenX>
FAA = Federal Aviation Administration, FASS = Fuel Air Separation System.
<darsie>
BottomLine: If I set up a second maneuver, changing its parameters messes up the first maneuver, so the trajectories change and the position of the first maneuver.
<darsie>
Sometimes.
<TwistenX>
darsie: How can your second maneuver effect your first maneuver?
<Althego>
also there is some wildelife issues too
<Althego>
there are some protected areas there
<darsie>
This has been going on ever since, so I thought there's nothing that can done about it.
<darsie>
TwistenX: Let's call it a bug?
<Althego>
there is a reason spacex is converting the oil rigs
<darsie>
They don't want to drill for oil? :)
<Solar_Oracle>
Predictably, the article's comments are a dumpster fire. The people posting below seem to think geostationary orbits get the same kind of nights as positions on Earth's surface.
* Solar_Oracle
laughs in orbital altitude and Earth's inclination.
<Althego>
lol kiara quoting anakin
<Althego>
(about the sand)
* raptop
assumes that kiara can deal with lava more easily though
<TwistenX>
darsie: Are you using the Maneuver Control App?
<darsie>
no
<Solar_Oracle>
@Althego The issue over noise pollution and local air traffic is probably why the whole Starship point-to-point ballistic transportation service will almost certainly never become a thing.
<raptop>
Solar_Oracle: I'd default to assuming that China is doing something other than space solar power, but do they not realize that the Earth doesn't take up half the sky at 36000 km?
<raptop>
*they as in the commenters
<darsie>
How long is the ship ride to/from the launch pad?
* raptop
assumes that they'd do something vaguely airport-like
<raptop>
(insert satellite parking joke here)
<Solar_Oracle>
@raptop Doesn't appear so, which is kind of funny given that Sunlight can be too abundant even in low orbit depending on the time of year.
<Solar_Oracle>
The only times of the year geostationary satellites get anything approaching frequent Sunlight interruptions would be around equinoxes.
* raptop
legit temporarily forgot that earth's inclination means that a geostationary sat would experience eclipse seasons
<darsie>
When someone buys a 30 min trip from NY to Sydney, high altitude wind shear could delay that for a day or more.
* raptop
blames KSP
<Solar_Oracle>
Viasat says that eclipses will last no longer than 72 minutes.
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<raptop>
hm
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<Solar_Oracle>
With interruptions being as brief as a minute from the beginning of the equinox season.
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<Solar_Oracle>
Any satellite in geostationary orbit literally spends over 99% of its time bathed in Sunlight, and the interruptions would be totally predictable.
<Solar_Oracle>
The commentary on it being a cover for a weapon system is also pretty silly. A ~gW laser/microwave beam would be a ginormous, hilariously vulnerable target.
<Solar_Oracle>
However, I doubt this could be pulled off with the LV system the CNSA is advertising, which is ~150 tons to orbit and partially reusable at best. Even with a fully reusable system, that's a tall order.
* Solar_Oracle
notes original proposals for SPS had most of the mass, the mirrors, made from Moon dust.
* raptop
wonders if Bob Zubrin's "zero divided by zero" complaint holds up
<raptop>
certainly there's still the silliness that those old SPS proposals assumed a 55 flight/year shuttle
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<Althego>
0/0?
<Solar_Oracle>
I think *most* SPS proposals assumed a high number of flights per year with a new Shuttle design, especially by replacing the Orbiter.
<raptop>
something about how the costs and the like work out
<raptop>
I think it was something like zero expense at zero profit
<Solar_Oracle>
Should've turned on sandbox mode.
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<Solar_Oracle>
Alright, time for a break and then I'll return to . . . Suffering.
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<darsie>
Ohh, 'aim camera here' is an advanced tweakable, too, it seems.
<darsie>
Ok, I put the rock in the experiment storage in orbit.
* darsie
forgot a chute ...
<flayer>
oops
<packbart>
darsie: why would you ever turn off advanced tweakables? :)
<raptop>
packbart: presumably forced to as part of upgrading to a new version
<darsie>
I started a completely fresh game.
<packbart>
raptop: I just copy the settings.cfg from the old version (on Windows, with versions in different directories) or upgrade in place (on the Linux laptop)
<packbart>
ah, ok, I see
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<TwistenX>
Hey, guys? I forget the answer to this question, but, how many Kerbonauts can the Mk3 Cockpit hold?
<raptop>
4
<kubi>
where is the 1.12.1 bugfix?
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<TwistenX>
raptop: thanks
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<Solar_Oracle>
Do users ever really go away?
<Azander>
hmmnm
<Solar_Oracle>
This is a subject for philosoraptor.
<raptop>
They do if you disembowl them, but that has some additional problems
<Solar_Oracle>
Remember, you're alive when they begin to eat you.
* raptop
guesses that's more of a velociraptor thing. umbralraptors prefer to cook their food
<Solar_Oracle>
I think it's an extrapolation based on existing terrestrial predators. This is especially relevant in reference to birds of prey, which also use their feet to restrain their prey.
<Solar_Oracle>
Though the last paper I read on the subject of raptor hunting behavior awkwardly tried using monitor lizards as the closest analog.
* raptop
checks wikipedia, and apparently there are some pack hunting birds
<Solar_Oracle>
There was another paper which argued that data from Deinonychus teeth meant they did not hunt in packs, but I'm not really sure the conclusion really fit the data as much as they argued.
<Solar_Oracle>
I mean, even assuming the premise of age determined diet is correct, there are animals today that actually move around in age determined groups.
<packbart>
monitor lizards are placed at the front of the stage, facing the performers
<Solar_Oracle>
Likewise, I'm not sure if the data's really as viable as they claimed given that it's possible for multiple populations within a single species to have dramatically varied diets dependent on their location.
<Solar_Oracle>
We're not talking about a bunch of teeth gathered from a confirmed single population group, but organisms separated by hundreds of thousands or even millions of years.
<Solar_Oracle>
Haven't been able to review the paper in full, though, so I really can't comment on the methodology
* darsie
recovered the Minmus stone transport probe from LKO with a Klaw Jr.
<Solar_Oracle>
I'll have to take a short break and it's off to more agony-reading.
<Solar_Oracle>
Yes-yes!
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<raptop>
!outcome add It worked more or less as expected.
<LunchBot>
raptop: Added outcome: It worked more or less as expected.
<raptop>
!mission add You fire off large amounts of chaff and flares in an attempt to escape a gimbal lock.
<LunchBot>
raptop: Added mission: You fire off large amounts of chaff and flares in an attempt to escape a gimbal lock.