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<Pap>
Can someone post the link to Procedural Avionics?
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<CobaltWolf>
Shit did I miss any praise
<Pap>
It has been very quiet
<CobaltWolf>
oh
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<Pap>
egg, are you available?
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<xShadowx>
Pap: like 6am for frenchies, give it a few hours
<Pap>
That's what I guessed, just saw his name wasn't listed as sleeping, didn't know if he was still up celebrating a victory for Democracy, lol
<xShadowx>
1) not a victory for democracy 2) democracy cannot be a victory
<xShadowx>
no country is a true democracy, at best democratic republic, and true democracy lets uninformed/uneducated people choose things based on which way the media blows the sheeple ;p
<Pap>
xShadowx, unfortunately, I agree with you
<xShadowx>
i guess if a ountry had an IQ requirement, than democracy could win
<xShadowx>
oh whats the movie that just came out like that.....i gotta see that
<CobaltWolf>
except IQ is a bullshit statistic. They'd need to require emotional maturity.
<xShadowx>
CobaltWolf: then we wouldnt have some of our more.....eccentric....inventors ;p
<CobaltWolf>
would we want any of them making political decisions that affect millions?
<xShadowx>
they dont need to make choices, to still effect them ;\
<Starwaster>
blowfish: yes, if by weight and hair loss you mean a population culling based on IQ
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<stratochief>
Pap: it is in the master branch of the RP-0 repo, I believe. it is built into the RP0.dll, IIRC
<Pap>
Yeah, stratochief I am a moron
<stratochief>
Pap: nah, you just guessed wrong or something :P
<Pap>
I am having trouble describing the Molniya contract and Tundra contract to the player now without drawing the Orbit, I am finishing my Early Communications Network contract test right now and will play it to see what it looks like
<stratochief>
Pap: eh, elliptical orbits that are high over the northern hemisphere, with a period of <fill in fraction of sideral day>
<Oro>
hey guys, I have a quick question - I messed up my TACLS config at the start of the game, and now my kerbals use up a stupidly high amount of oxygen - is there any way to change a config mid save?
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<Oro>
I'm talking "mars mission requires a spaceship to be 50% oxygen
<xShadowx>
Oro: make a new game, write down values, goto old game, set
<github>
RealismOverhaul/master 06319c7 PhineasFreak: Spaces to tabs
<github>
[RealismOverhaul] stratochief66 closed pull request #1627: Fix some wrong & missing MM passes (master...RO-RealChute-Pass-Fixes) https://git.io/v9EKH
<github>
[RealismOverhaul] stratochief66 pushed 3 new commits to master: https://git.io/v9rZ9
<github>
RealismOverhaul/master b0ca536 PhineasFreak: Fix some wrong & missing MM passes
<github>
RealismOverhaul/master e01a0ab stratochief66: Merge pull request #1627 from PhineasFreak/RO-RealChute-Pass-Fixes...
<github>
RealismOverhaul/master 0028eba PhineasFreak: More passes
<xShadowx>
spam :D
<xShadowx>
stratosleep is sleep spamming
<Pap>
He actaully pushes PR's in his sleep, like sleep walking, but with a positive benefit
<xShadowx>
thats awesome :D
<xShadowx>
i write code in my sleep o.O
<Pap>
I work in Excel in my sleep
<xShadowx>
no joke one time i fell asleep in chair, and i think i woke up like part way but it felt like i was heavily drugged so maybe just asleep and i dreamt i wrote code then in morning i woke up for real and appearwently some code was written but not the code i dreamt i wrote and it was buggy but not bad and i thought wtf
<Pap>
lol, thats funny
<Pap>
night all
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waves at soundnfury
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<Sigma88>
0/
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<Qboid>
[#651] title: Procedural Avionics cost is over the top | I've built a 2t sat based on the procedural avionics with type probe core (since it's a probe, not a upper stage or booster). Mass and volume seems ok-ish, but pricing is way over the top. I think there is some tweaking neccessary.... | https://github.com/KSP-RO/RP-0/issues/651
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<Pap|Bed>
Hey Sigma88 , i have a question for you about how contracts work with SD
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<CobaltWolf>
o/
<Pap>
o/ CobaltWolf
<CobaltWolf>
Pap do you ever sleep?
<CobaltWolf>
you're always here when I am
<CobaltWolf>
bbiab
<Pap>
I get about 5-6 hours a night, then when I am at work I always have IRC and Discord going
<Sigma88>
Pap: I'm not the best person to ask
<Sigma88>
but sure
<Sigma88>
I can try answer
<Pap>
Ok, so the contract packs I have are dynamic. They take information about the bodies from inside the game instead of declaring that you need to reach say 140,000 meters, the contract will look for HomeWorld().AtmosphereAltitude()
<Pap>
That returns the height that transitions into space, so 70,000 for Kerbin, 140,000 for RSS
<Sigma88>
sure
<Pap>
With Sigma Dimensions, apparently the contract is reading the height of the original planetary bodies, before the scaling takes place
<Pap>
So for SSRSS, there are reports that they need to reach 100,000 meters to complete a Karman Line Contract
<Sigma88>
you should probably report that to nightingale and tell him to get in contact with me if he cannot fix it in CC
<Pap>
ok, I will do that
<Sigma88>
the solution would be to change CC so that it reads the parameter "later"
<Sigma88>
or alternatively to change SD to write them earlier
<Sigma88>
but I'm not 100% I can do that
<Pap>
alright, I will reach out to him
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<CobaltWolf>
back
<acc>
hullu Pap, Sigma88, CobaltWolf
<CobaltWolf>
mornin
<Pap>
o/ acc
<CobaltWolf>
anybody have any opinions on what I need to work on updating next for BDB? I worked on Titan for a bit yesterday
<Pap>
Atlas
<CobaltWolf>
fuck
<Pap>
^that will always be my answer
<CobaltWolf>
B-but I need to model for that
<Pap>
lol
<CobaltWolf>
use FASA's
<Pap>
I am using FASA's and the texture differences to literally everything else in my game are jarring and make my eyes bleed
<CobaltWolf>
sorry haha
<CobaltWolf>
new BDB Atlas is gonna be really nice I just don't want to have to work on it...
<acc>
heh
<Pap>
Fair enough
<Pap>
Serious question though, other than Atlas, isn't all the old stuff retextured now?
<CobaltWolf>
not even remotely close
<CobaltWolf>
uhm
<CobaltWolf>
the main Gemini parts are mostly done. LEM is pretty much done. Saturn V is... mostly done I guess. Titan line is maybe 1/3 done.
<CobaltWolf>
Thor, Redstone, Vanguard are mostly done
<Sigma88>
0/ acc
<Pap>
I vote Gemini, Redstone, Thor in that order
<Pap>
Actually Titan is needed as well
<Pap>
So all of them
<CobaltWolf>
Past that, I gotta do... Atlas, Juno, Diamant, Saturn 1, Delta II, Apollo, MOL, Centaur, Vega, all the probe, antenna, science stuff... all the solid stuff like MX/Athena. Skylab needs a pass then needs the rest of its parts finished.
* acc
needs some moarrr coffee
<Pap>
As far as unmanned Sample Return contracts, I have Mercury, Mars, Europa and an Asteroid. Are there any others that should be considered? Should Mercury be removed from the list?
<acc>
the more the better
<Pap>
So just make a sample return mission for basically all solid bodies?
<acc>
maybe in three classes: planet, moon, asteroid
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<Theysen>
Pap: I remember you were looking through the older mods and checking for current compatability? Is there any place you keep notice about that since I would like to give the RO OP a facelift once we have new mods and old mods flipped out. Cheers
<Pap>
Theysen, I will update that Isse on the github
<Pap>
*Issue
<CobaltWolf>
*cough* Pap
<Theysen>
ha right I remember :)
<Theysen>
I heard raidernick also mentioning e.g. the launchers pack is not active ynmore until the ULA stuff is launched so that has to be deleted as well etc
<stratosleep>
Theysen: RO#1615
<Qboid>
[#1615] title: Compatibility of Mods - Running List | As I am working through adding parts for the RP-0 Tech Tree, I am going through the currently supported mods for Realism Overhaul. I will post my notes here and others can determine how much support (will we place parts on the Tree, etc) do we want to provide for these.... | https://github.com/KSP-RO/RealismOverhaul/issues/1615
<Theysen>
tyvm
<CobaltWolf>
Theysen: ULA pack is still being worked on?
<Pap>
Right, the ULA will replace everything except for SpaceX
<Theysen>
gotcha
<Pap>
@CobaltWolf, it is supposedly going to be released soon
<Theysen>
last thing I heard ULA has to pass their agreement on that?
<Theysen>
i'd speak against removing AIES; it has nice engines and a vinci especially :P
<acc>
and landing legs
<acc>
also some good looking probe cores
<Theysen>
yes definitely
<Theysen>
gonna test if it is still running properly with the last version we have
<CobaltWolf>
AIES is old tho. Akron from Coatl Aerospace wanted to basically remake all the probe parts but he didn't since he felt it would be stepping on Carmics' toes
<Pap>
Does AIES work still?
<Theysen>
yes so why remove it?
<Theysen>
testing right now
<Pap>
Remember, by moving something to Deprecated does not mean to remove it, but should it be in the suggested list?
<Theysen>
if it still works and shows no problems I would keep it.
<CobaltWolf>
Not saying it should be removed. Saying someone should make a better one with more up to date art. The big stuff from the pack is the probe stuff, the legs, all the neat bits. Things like the tanks don't need to get remade since they're never really used
<Theysen>
it's mostly about the engines exactly, majority deletes the tanks and stuff anyways
<acc>
the legs might need some more fixing than config changes
<Pap>
I think there should be the following lists if you want to clean it up: Dependent, Recommended, Suggested, Working in RO (but not updated), Broken
<CobaltWolf>
wait what engines is it used for?
<CobaltWolf>
I remember the engines being ugly and underpowered
<Theysen>
No idea about stock for AIES, I'm talking RO configs
<stratosleep>
Pap: agreed. if AIES has borked landing legs for example it can be in the Broken pile. with the configs in the 'on the way out, unless OP updates dis shit" folder, but entirely still accessible to users
<Theysen>
I am gonna look through and see if all engines in there are replaced by any other mod at this point, if so we can drop official support and just leave that in what is working
<stratosleep>
Pap: Theysen and when a mod is in the Broken pile, it either doesn't get mentioned or gets a minor mention, since we do sorta have configs for it an it does sorta work
<stratosleep>
(in the RO OP)
<CobaltWolf>
Theysen: I suppose. I don't remember anything special from the engines. The probe parts were the USP for the mod IMO
<Theysen>
yup, I only remember the Vinci for my personal needs but, as per usual SSTU got a better config now :P
<Theysen>
and starshine, that model was bliss
<Theysen>
but thats 0.90 and we have to draw a line somewhere, maybe we get another modder to make a dedicated model for it
<Theysen>
off topic, I'm running through designated survivor and I have to say I wasn't hooked by a new series like that in forever
<CobaltWolf>
Theysen: those are IRL engines?
<Theysen>
Vinci?
<Pap>
Theysen, I stopped Designated Survivor about 6 episodes in due to time constraints, do I need to get back to it?
<CobaltWolf>
Theysen: O
<CobaltWolf>
fuck
<CobaltWolf>
not O
<Theysen>
Vinci is european upper stage pride haha
<CobaltWolf>
oh shit, gotcha
<stratosleep>
Theysen: mein Frau's vader loves that show. I haven't had time to watch it yet
<CobaltWolf>
the one that's also used by ISRO under a different name right?
<Theysen>
nope never heard about that
<Theysen>
Vinci is hydrolox restartable for Ariane 6 upper stage
<Theysen>
stratosleep, star wars day was on the 4th :P
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<stratosleep>
Theysen: *Vater, sorry. Ich bin ein dum kopf
<Theysen>
if he is mean and such Vader is a nice coincidence :)
<CobaltWolf>
Theysen: oh, no. Their Vikas is the Ariane's Viking engine, but the Vinci is not used in any ISRO vehicle
<Theysen>
exactly, their Ariane 4 reaminings are used by the ISRO
<acc>
centaur <3
<Theysen>
nono :O
<acc>
not related to your discussion here :D
<acc>
just did a nice launch
<Theysen>
of course, vinci is the same purpose engine :PÜ
<Theysen>
I love double RL-10 centaurs
<Theysen>
less time to wait and less chances to fuck up that low twr ascent profile..
<CobaltWolf>
I didn't realize that apparently they haven't done a dual RL-10 launch with Atlas V yet?
<Pap>
stratosleep, even though you are sleeping, For rover contracts, available after the first Flyby of each planet, or after the first landing?
<acc>
Pap: I would say flyby, so you're free to decide if you want to send a rover for the first landing
<Pap>
that is what I thought too, acc
<acc>
keeps things a litle bit more open for different play styles
<Pap>
So now, after the first flyby of a planet, you will have a contract available for the following: Orbit, Landing, and Rover
<Pap>
Then after your first landing, you will have a new contract for a Sample Return Mission
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<acc>
sounds good
<acc>
hey rsparkyc
<rsparkyc>
morning
<Qboid>
rsparkyc: stratochief left a message for you in #RO [06.05.2017 00:56:17]: ": well sure, but you know not to bug people about it gives you issues"
<schnobs>
Pap: the ordering isn't that important as long as you don't insist on launching a new vessel for the contracts.
<CobaltWolf>
honestly the 'must use new vessel' requirement for contracts just leads to aggravation for me when I screw up (forget to take the contract before I launch)
<schnobs>
^this, among others
<Pap>
@CobaltWolf, part of the reason that the Must Use New Vessel requirement exists is because of how the contracts are considered "complete" by KSP and CC
<Pap>
Many times it is needed to not trigger completions of contracts that should not be completed
<Pap>
But I agree with you that it is frustrating at times
<schnobs>
Actually....
<schnobs>
I haven't looked, but could this kind of stuff be sorted in among the many many "firsts"?
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<schnobs>
I like how stock has solved the issue, and I'd love if RP-0 would likewise get rid of the contract clutter
<Pap>
what do you mean schnobs ?
<schnobs>
In stock, the altitude records, and generally all the first time doing this or that, don't even pop up as a contract anymore.
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<schnobs>
I don't know where the discussion on advance payments went. But if advances are to be reduced, one might well turn all these mission steps into "firsts". Contracts for follow-up mission would only pop up after the first has happened (and may require a new vessel so you don't complete it by switching to the same old rover).
<Pap>
schnobs, I understand now
<Pap>
From my knowledge, that is not possible using the Contract Configurator system the way it is setup now, but someone else might have more knowledge on it than me
<schnobs>
The differences between a ordinary contract and a first: contracts offer a) advance payment, and are b) repeatable.
<schnobs>
Anything I missed?
<Pap>
There isn't really anyone to ask since Nightingale doesn't come around too much anymore
<CobaltWolf>
Pap: was he employed by squad for a while?
<Pap>
CobaltWolf, he was, according to RD he left on his own
<schnobs>
I think so.
<Pap>
he was there after all the other devs quit / left
<xShadowx>
nightinggale left for 'family reasons' shortly after all the other devs left
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* xShadowx
think he saw the ship sinking after he tried to stick it out
<Theysen>
new fusebox seems to not be working with RO somehow
<CobaltWolf>
Pap: yeah, sure...
<Pap>
Theysen, I have had it working what I thought was ok?
<Theysen>
It gives me constant 100% although the probe is emoty
<Pap>
Yeah, very, very strange what happened at Squad with the mod devs. Somehow only JPLRepo and RD survived / decided to stay
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<CobaltWolf>
my theory is that RD was the only one smart enough to negotiate his contract and actually get a good deal out of it all.
<CobaltWolf>
But I'm on the other side of that whole wall, I don't have the slightest idea what actually goes on behind the scenes
<schnobs>
Sometimes I wonder if the whole gang is still working for squad, or rather some subsidiary, producing a proper RealismOverhault kind of DLC.
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<schnobs>
Heavily NDA'd of course.
<CobaltWolf>
schnobs: all I know is after people work for Squad, they don't ever really come back to the community
<schnobs>
And that this is the reason why they're making themselves so scarce.
<schnobs>
I know.
<schnobs>
Burnout is a thing, as is anger.
<CobaltWolf>
yeah. So then what does that say about Squad?
<Pap>
Well, other than having a phenomenal idea for a game, it has never seemed to anyone like Squad had a clue of what they were doing
<schnobs>
It was not only that the idea was good.
<schnobs>
The brought the product to a stage where it became useable.
<schnobs>
I'm a bit reminded of the inception of linux.
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<BadRocketsCo>
o/
<CobaltWolf>
o/
<schnobs>
The reason Linux made it was not that it was so well thought-out, but that it was in a state where you could use it already. And you could tamper with it.
<CobaltWolf>
really? The people I know that use Linux a lot act like it's a gift from god :P
<schnobs>
in a way, it was.
<schnobs>
I don't think Linus himself was aware of what he was doing. But unlike so many dead ends and false starts, he developed his thing into a state where others could not only see the potential, but "almost" utilize it. Maybe a minor tweak here or there ... well, you know how it goes.
<schnobs>
He single-handedly took the free kernel from being a pie-in-the-sky to something tangible. I can't argue how useful it really was, but obviously it was good enough for others to add to it, in a way that didn't happen with any earlier project. And off it took.
<schnobs>
Anyhoo, to come back, Squad not only had the idea but made it into something people would actually pay for. And make mods for. And so on.
<Pap>
Yes, that is true schnobs
<Pap>
Squad has just mismanaged their handling of the community, IMHO
<xShadowx>
and ksp wouldnt exist without the modders ;p
<xShadowx>
squad just rolled the dice on a concept that people got attracted to
<CobaltWolf>
I'm not disagreeing schnobs , but you can't deny Squad hasn't exactly always been professional or intelligent, especially in regards to the community
<xShadowx>
as for 'idea' ever seen the minions movies? ;p
<xShadowx>
makes ya wonder who came first
<xShadowx>
too long ago to remember, didnt ksp accually have taller leggy 'people'?
<schnobs>
xShadowx: when I first put money on the table, I was buying stock KSP. I wasn't aware of any mods until much later.
<Theysen>
best of a human model we got this far XD
<xShadowx>
schnobs: as is the case for many people, word of mouth spread it, friends told friends to buy, my case friends told me to buy it, didnt mention any mods, i saw them play it, looked cool, bought it, disappointed that everything he was doing was accually mods XD went and got mods
<Theysen>
reading Nathan's request at Porkjet for a human model on Github issue for RO 1.1 update .. RIP :(
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<CobaltWolf>
Theysen: if someone could figure out *how* to inject that into the game, i could rig it fairly easily I think
<CobaltWolf>
like, to get it working with the bones properly
<Theysen>
IIRC the kerbals are hardcoded right?
<CobaltWolf>
I think so
<Theysen>
with all the interactions and animations
<CobaltWolf>
but someone made a mod to animate kerbals...
<xShadowx>
just because a lot of stuff is hardcoded in, doesnt mean it cant be replaced :|
<CobaltWolf>
yeah
<Theysen>
yes but if it was easier to do I am sure we had something by now right?
<xShadowx>
never said its all easy :P
<Theysen>
so let's stick to the funny Hat of chris p :^)
<Pap>
yeah, Theysen I mean someone created Scott Manley's head, I'm guessing the first new model that would have been made was some naked chick by some pubescent teenager
<Theysen>
that was Texture Replacer wasn't it?
<xShadowx>
^
<Pap>
yes Theysen
<Theysen>
NSFW mods for KSP , hell yeah
<acc>
naked greendwarfs? I'm not sure
<CobaltWolf>
btw where is Chris? They haven't been around in a while
<Theysen>
no idea, rl stuff, fed up, uninspired?
<CobaltWolf>
ah
<Theysen>
can only guess his stuff was inspiring
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<stratochief|remote>
Pap: yeah, offeiring rover after flyby has been accomplished
<stratochief|remote>
schnobs: if you (or anybody) can 'proof of concept' a first planetary flyby as a paid world first, we'd probably be open to it
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<Starwaster>
now I can't get the BGs Stayin Alive out of my head
<Theysen>
oO
<Theysen>
that's nasty
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<regex>
Bee Gees own.
<regex>
but Stayin' Alive is played.
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<schnobs>
colleague was looking for a ka-ching sound.
<schnobs>
I suggested to cut up pink floyd's money.
<acc>
to the moon!
<schnobs>
workmate not convinced, but couldn't get rid of the tune for a week or so.
<CobaltWolf>
sounds like that'd be a bit too much work
<schnobs>
Reminds me, there's an utterly silly "Asteroid demolishes Earth" video out there. Someone had the grand idea of setting it to "The Great Gig in the Sky". It works.
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<acc>
is there a secret how reset focus in map view works nowadays?
<Theysen>
backspace
<Pap>
It isn't backspace anymore
<Pap>
It is the single apostrophe next to the 1 key on an American keyboard
<Pap>
Under the ESC key
<Theysen>
^°
<Pap>
I learned it only a week ago after assuming some mod had screwed mine up
<Theysen>
and I swear it works for me in map view with backspace - but only once.
<Theysen>
and then I started digging too
<Theysen>
but didn't find something thanks Pap
<acc>
doesn't work for me
<acc>
both
<Pap>
acc, yours is broken then
<Pap>
lol
<acc>
it's free view there
<acc>
like rotating the cam without holding the mouse button
<Theysen>
i bet it's a keyboard thing between americano and deutsch
<acc>
and backspace does nothing at all
<acc>
possible
<acc>
but weird. I'm so used to that while navigating
<acc>
despite that flyby probe and impacter are on their way to the cheeze
<Pap>
Nice acc
<acc>
and as bonus the flyby probe does a slingshot out on a solar orbit. comms might be good enough to catch some science at SOI change :D
<stratochief|remote>
Pap: You asked me how complicated the ISRU for my proposed Mars mission is. I finally got a copy of Zubrin's "Case for Mars"
<stratochief|remote>
The Johnson Space Center team also gave Martin Marietta a small amount of money—$47,000 to be exact—to demonstrate what I had claimed was a simple chemical engineering technology for transforming the Martian atmosphere into rocket propellant. We did so, building in the course of three months a full-scale unit that operated at 94 percent efficiency. The demonstration was all the more convincing given that neither I, the
<stratochief|remote>
project’s lead engineer, nor anyone else on the team was actually a chemical engineer by training. If we could build such a machine, then it couldn’t be that hard.
<Pap>
stratochief|remote, so we really have no excuses for not going to Mars
<Pap>
Except that historically we are at about a 50% success rate
<Pap>
Probably a little better than that now
<stratochief|remote>
yeah, working out EDL (entry, descent, landing) is an important challenge to get right before you start throwing people at a ball :P
<stratochief|remote>
Pap: we've got excuses, NASA chose a robotic sciences program over an engineering program to develop and demonstrate the advances necessary for a human mission to Mars. and they certainly got a lot of science returns from that
<Pap>
It says something they even NASA refers to the EDL as 7 minutes of terror
<Pap>
Very true
<stratochief|remote>
IMO, it was the LEO Shuttle/ISS program that we could have done without, or cut back by half or more to allow the development and demonstration of human-supporting tech for pursuing Mars
<stratochief|remote>
but ideally, the US would spend a few billion more per year on science/space funding, and cut the troop and base counts in germany, japan, south korea, etc. by a few percent
<Pap>
Yes, there really could only have been one choice, either the Shuttle or Apollo Applications type stuff to keep going out. That being said, I think that realistically having something like the ISS was necessary to actually have a successful Mars human program
<stratochief|remote>
I'd agree, but only because "something like ISS" is very broad. I like the appeal of wetlab conversion for sizable, long term space stations
<CobaltWolf>
right PITA to get equipment up tho
<stratochief|remote>
you could probably get the experience required in long term space habitation from something a third or so the size/coast of ISS, or a tighter partnership with the Russians, since they were already committed to developing long term station experience in the early 70s
<CobaltWolf>
I'm a fan of mixed construction, wet segments for filling out your hab space and that sort of stuff
<stratochief|remote>
CobaltWolf: well, yes. you do indeed need to bring up <something> to jam into that big, cold tank :)
<stratochief|remote>
CobaltWolf: have you seen the original designs for a Saturn V S-II wetlab? an aero fairing would cover where the S-IVb would normally be, covering a huge mass of equipment to be moved on a long truss into the S-II for a giant wetlab
<CobaltWolf>
I've seen a little bit
<CobaltWolf>
basically they just need all that initial equipment to weigh less that S-IVB, right? Since the S-II almost makes orbit
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<stratochief|remote>
as a cheap bastard, I'm doing a S-IVb wetlab conversion in my RP-0 series. so, I can have a skylab sized station using only 2-4 Saturn IB launches
<stratochief|remote>
Theysen: you're welcome :)
<stratochief|remote>
Wernher's style of sketch is pleasantly like my own
<Theysen>
that sketch looks so german somehow lol
<CobaltWolf>
I enjoy the use of the word 'lug' in reference to how much weight can be brought
<stratochief|remote>
if anything can 'lug' weight into space, it is a G.D. Saturn V
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<stratochief|remote>
I intend to get 1-2 month partial-G experience with extended lunar missions, 2 Saturn V's each mission, probably 2 or 3 total missions like that over the 70s-early 80s.
<stratochief|remote>
then, hopefully be able to construct a decent zero G station, capable of half a year durations for 3-5 people out of Saturn IB wetlab, with either BDB ETS Apollos for providing resupply, or just lots of uncrewed Gemini
<CobaltWolf>
BDB uncrewed Gemini?
<stratochief|remote>
Then, a full Saturn V launch of the payload I intend to send crew in to Mars, spin it up in LEO or MEO to demonstrate the long-term partial G coast duration plan, and the following year or two the first Mars EDL, ISRU full scale but beast will go to Mars, demo ISRU and probably a sample return, maybe deliver a rover or two
<stratochief|remote>
CobaltWolf: possibly, if those are configured for RO/RP-0 by then. if not, the FASA ones that are already configured
<CobaltWolf>
T.T
<CobaltWolf>
Naw I made an actual uncrewed gemini capsule that's separate from the normal one
<CobaltWolf>
FASA's gonna have me beat for Gemini b/c the doors etc are more accurate
<stratochief|remote>
CobaltWolf: ahh, interesting. what did you make different about the uncrewed Gemini from a crewed one, functionally? full of food, etc. instead of space-homies?
<stratochief|remote>
the FASA doors may be more accurate, but the FASA Gemini proportions are a dash wonky. at least, they don't see to scale perfectly when taken to RO scale
<CobaltWolf>
stratochief|remote: It is truncated a bit further up to accent up to APAS size ports
<stratochief|remote>
hasn't already 2-3 people volunteered to configure some BDB parts for RO? why so much talk, and so few PRs? regardless of what other people do, I'm more than happy to test PRs for BDB parts that hit RO, and I'll continue configuring bits that I need for my Rp-0 alt timeline
<CobaltWolf>
stratochief|remote: I don't know. I don't even like doing the cfgs for the stock version :/
<Pap>
I am one of them stratochief|remote , but I have been focused elsewhere with the contracts first
<stratochief|remote>
CobaltWolf: you do far more than enough work to create BDB, no need to make RO configs. they'll exist, eventually :)
<stratochief|remote>
acc: nice! sleak craft, looks like a Titan II, but I can't see the payload. gotta take 2 pictures, one with a flash (ie. AmbientLightAdjust) so we can see the craft too :)
<acc>
the LV?
<stratochief|remote>
CobaltWolf: oh, neat, very interesting. I like the idea
<stratochief|remote>
acc: yeah, payload & LV
<acc>
and thanks :)
<acc>
but there is the payload?
<CobaltWolf>
stratochief|remote: one of my contributors was actually able to find a PDF with real information on that
<Pap>
acc, it is too dark to see the details well
<acc>
flyby probe and the centaur as impacter
<stratochief|remote>
CobaltWolf: cool! do you still have it?
<CobaltWolf>
Something along the lines of McDonnell trying to muscle in for cargo deliveries for stations if Big G wasn't used for crew
<acc>
but there is one pic after sep on the day side of earth
<stratochief|remote>
CobaltWolf: that lookss like gemini's response to Soyuz
<CobaltWolf>
stratochief|remote: not sure what you mean?
<stratochief|remote>
CobaltWolf: the body looks somewhat like the "headlight" shape of the Soyuz re-entry module, and the upper bit is like a small cylindrical orbital module. although obviously not seperable
<CobaltWolf>
yeah the upper bit is the docking mechanism
<CobaltWolf>
the supplies have to transfer via EVA in that configuration
<CobaltWolf>
but you can swap it for an apollo docking mechanism which is what I beleive the proposal is
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<stratochief>
*sigh*, why do I have to seriously address the potential of geo-engineering to combat climate change? do any of you folk believe geo-engineering Earth is a sound strategy, or even know what it is?
<UmbralRaptor>
Probably not, and yes, respectively
<UmbralRaptor>
Well, actually, I have to revise the first one. *some* geoengineering is probably a good idea.
<Pap>
I think it is going to become an RO Recommended Mod soon
<Theysen>
obviously but give it time, has he made any update on official KCT?
<xShadowx>
Agathorn: ^
<Pap>
Theysen, as far as I know, he has not updated KCT officially yet
<Theysen>
just grabbed the latest dev build from his repo
<Theysen>
will be nice for one you get into many manned missions to not have to rebuild the complete capsusle
<Theysen>
hopefully one can configure refurbishment times
<Pap>
Yeah, I agree, I always overbuild extra everything when I am planning a mission in case of a failure, this will be great to re-use those
<Theysen>
so assuming he is expanding on the original KCT inventory this means when I scrap a surplus launcher and rebuilt a rocket with the same engine this one gets used instead and not just only the recovered ones
<Pap>
That is what I read it like, but we will see I guess
<Pap>
Or instead of scrapping it, maybe your put it into storage?
<Theysen>
yeah or there are two options scrap and inventorsy
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<stratochief>
Pap: I mean, things like continous salt-water spraying ships on the ocean, pumping sulphur-dioxide into the air, or seeding iron fertizer to the ocean to cause quick, large algae growths to soak up (and hopefully sink) carbon out of the atmo
<stratochief>
Pap: things that could produce cooling effects to counter warming actions like CO2 emission, rather than just directly investing more cash to reduce CO2 emission
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<Pap>
Ah, that is what I guessed, but didn't know for sure
<Pap>
stratochief|away, if you lived in my country, the government would tell you that none of that is necessary because global warming is not real (MORONS!!!)
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<UmbralRaptor>
Is this the country that thinks illness is a sign of sin?
* UmbralRaptor
glares at AHCA justifications.
<Agathorn>
xShadowx: ?
<xShadowx>
poked in relation to that mod, for TF to tie into
<xShadowx>
didnt get a chance to fully read but looked like he pulled the parts inventory out of KCT for standalone mod
<Agathorn>
hmmm TF was never really so much about tracking usage of individual items
<Agathorn>
it was more about the overall technology improvement
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<xShadowx>
the problem was (back then) KCT would put a recovered engine in inventory to 'refurbish' so to speak but lose the TF data
<Theysen>
i just love how I can physwarp through science transmission again finally...
* xShadowx
makes a mod to break that for Theysen
<Theysen>
get out :^)
<xShadowx>
Agathorn: what you wanna do is up to you, just poking to pass the related info :|
<Theysen>
but that stupid nasty freeze of the tech tree is back worse than before where after unlocking one node it freezes up
<Theysen>
clicking the first node to reset doesn't work
<xShadowx>
i wonder how much people ould freak, if when opening R&D to view tech tree, it started to burn like fire at the edge of blueprint
<Theysen>
LOL :D
<Theysen>
with a high pitched sound or something
<Theysen>
head resonance frequency
<Theysen>
great I don't have the concic cockpit in my tree.. if for once it wouldn't break something
<Theysen>
AS IF I FORGOT COMMUNITY TECH TREE ...
<Theysen>
please make CKAN compatibility ok thx bye /s
<xShadowx>
lolz
<xShadowx>
not all mods arwe 1.2.2 yet
<Theysen>
sarcasm xShadowx .. "/s" sorry
<Theysen>
im just blind and angry about it :D
<Theysen>
gnight all O/
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<Agathorn>
One obvious thing would be to track the data on each individual part so if you fly that part again, you would go "back" to the data & reliability of that older part. Problem with that is while it would be "real" it could be both confusing and difficult for the user as there would be no real way to see what was going on
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<xShadowx>
Agathorn: the wy i view it is 1) if part went to pad, but never launched, its 'new old stock', keeps its same state, but perhaps a retrofit option to pay a bit and make it 'new stock' as if just newly spawned 2) for stuff that did launch, i consider 'refurbished', some parts of it got replaced / retrofitted, but its still a little used, so perhaps 'new stock' with a slight penalty to reliability
<Agathorn>
you are talking about something else though
<Agathorn>
what are are referring to is something I originally decided not to handle, as it was basically already done by DamnIt! which was making parts fail based on usage
<Agathorn>
what I was talking about is that if you fly a part A, which gives you new data used to make parts B through E better, if you then go back and fly part A again, realistically your reliability should drop back to what it was originally on Part A
<Agathorn>
but doing so would be very confusing to the user because they wouldn't see that infromation when choosing to refly a part
<xShadowx>
if they fly vessel A with part A, get data to 1000, then fly vessel B with Part B, data goes to 2000, if switching back to vessel A the part is at 1000
<xShadowx>
so simply moving the part to vessel C is what the inventory is doing
<xShadowx>
using vessel would already give me the feeling you describe, and people seem to handle it fine
<xShadowx>
vessel A*
<xShadowx>
the only question is, would they expect vessel C to be entirely new part, which what i said above can bidge that, by using 'new old stock'/'refurbished' vs brand new
<Agathorn>
it isn't the data I am worried about but the reliability rating
<Agathorn>
what if you have 3 old parts, each with less reliability than the current level, but each has different reliabilities
<Agathorn>
would you have some option to see the individual parts and that their reliability is so you can then choose which to re-use?
<xShadowx>
(after quickly reading the above mod might be missing some) doesnt placing in VAB take out of inventory? not just 'grab parts at launch'? is what it sounded like, so you can see in VAB theyre not a matched set, and change the odd refurb out for a new :P
<Agathorn>
tl;dr an old used part isn't going to magically be more reliable, so re-using a part means flying it at its original level of reliability, but unless that is more transparent to the player it sounds mean
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<xShadowx>
oh i agree show em the stats in VAB and all so they know, but it also doesnt need to strictly pick up where it left off, refurbished stuff is better than it was, hell just today my dad took his truck in because a part was being recalled, they changed the part that has been failing for other people, and now its supposedly more reliable :P
<xShadowx>
(some piece in the transmission)
<Agathorn>
well the core idea has always been that the flight data allowed your engineers to improve the manufacture of new parts
<Agathorn>
thus why your reliability of a part doesn't inmprove during flight, only the next flight
<Agathorn>
so by that line of reasoning, re-using an old part it should be at the old reliability
<xShadowx>
and im saying let the old new ones come in, with button to continuie use vs retrofit to almost new :P
<xShadowx>
retrofitting and taking out a pump thats prone to failure, raises reliability of old part
<xShadowx>
not all the way to new, but better
<xShadowx>
or if you need matched set of new, go matched set of new :)
<Agathorn>
maybe..its part if why I asked magico what sort of interaction the player has with the system
<Agathorn>
if there isn't any interaction at all for example and it hjust makes flights cheaper and automatically pulls a part out of inventory, then no
<Agathorn>
if you have some interaction where you can allocate funds towards refurbishment..maybe
<Agathorn>
it really depends on how the mod is implemented
<xShadowx>
Agathorn: s/then no/then inventory mod needs adjusting to allow new vs old as choice
<xShadowx>
:)
<Qboid>
xShadowx thinks Agathorn meant to say: if there isn't any interaction at all for example and it hjust makes flights cheaper and automatically pulls a part out of inventory, then inventory mod needs adjusting to allow new vs old as choice
<xShadowx>
anyways, theres ideas, you 2 can figure out who does what :P
<xShadowx>
but thats def what i want lol
<xShadowx>
the system of recycled part is magically full new part, is just fakey
* xShadowx
needs to figure out a bug in his LS mod
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<CobaltWolf>
@stratochief|away where did you get that WvB notebook page from?
<CobaltWolf>
slash, are there more pages on that site?
<CobaltWolf>
Some people on FB are asking
<Agathorn>
Is that really von braun's writing? If so his English was much better that I thought it would be
<CobaltWolf>
it was very good
<stratochief|away>
Pap: neat (on scrapyard). I suppose we don't have a lot of forum hounds on this IRC, although finding it on a monday after it was released isn't bad :)
<stratochief|away>
Pap: obviously it will need some testing, to ensure it isn't buggy and doesn't cause issues with other RP-0 required mods
<CobaltWolf>
who here watches Top Gear? You know those fake facts he makes up about the Stig? I need a fake fact about lobsters. Don't ask why but it is important.
<stratochief|away>
Pap: (on global warming) well, if by government you mean "a leading chunk of the current executive seat fillers", sure. but past and future executive federal admins were and will be sane, there are other branches of federal, gov, the states have lots of power and have done lots of good work around climate change policy. so much inertia going already to decarbonize electricity, thankfully
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<Oro>
I return to ask yet another dumb, yet quick question
<CobaltWolf>
no
<Oro>
I've been having a blast with B9 Pwings in RP-0
<Oro>
but where can I get them for *gasp* stock?
<CobaltWolf>
ok well, someone else suggested a lobsterfact for me