<xShadowx>
oh wow never knew - ksp has a 'first' record, for tower buzz
<Pap>
rsparkyc: do you have time for a quick chat?
<rsparkyc>
sure, pming you
<acharles>
Does anyone know if there’s an issue with the XLR11 and TestFlight? I’m not getting the test flight middle click menu in the editor.
<Agathorn>
certainly should work so if it isn't then you got something messed up
<Agathorn>
1. Make sure you did NOT install the Stock Configs that TestFlight makes available
<Agathorn>
That is probably the most common mistake.. if you have a config directory in your TestFlight directory then delete it
<Agathorn>
Second, verify TF is indeed working properly. Do you have the middle click on other engines?
<lamont>
yeah i’ve used the XLR11 recently and TF worked
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<NathanKell>
!tell leudaimon so, question (and I guess you don't have to answer this :P ) --- are you planning to fly a test flight of your crewed launch, or just going all up at once? Because I'm now paranoid enough that I'm debating skipping the verification flight, but would feel very uncomfortable doing so and would only do so if you were also planning to skip the dog/chimp flight
<Qboid>
NathanKell: I'll redirect this as soon as they are around.
<NathanKell>
rsparkyc, Pap: Are you guys ready for a weekend release or should we hold off?
<NathanKell>
I'm fine whenever
<rsparkyc>
i think my stuff is all shored up now
<Pap>
I think the contracts through a manned Moon landing are well tested, we can always push small updates if something tragic comes up later
<NathanKell>
\o/
<NathanKell>
ok I'll do that tomorrow then :)
<rsparkyc>
it doesn't have as many tech nodes as we have avionics units, but we can add those later if we need too
<rsparkyc>
or people can switch no non-procedurals
<Agathorn>
skip certification flights?
<Agathorn>
if you are even soncidering it then it sounds like RIS needs to have a feature that really hurts you if you kill someone
<Pap>
I actually agree with that Agathorn
<Agathorn>
shouldn't be necouraged to risk your crew's lives
<NathanKell>
I agree on that
<Pap>
I think RtS should find a way to use Reputation for bonuses (basically if you are the leader, your reward for accomplishing something as a leader is modified by your reputation) and if someone dies, your reputation takes a tragic hit
<Pap>
NathanKell: we need to re-do all of the Procedural parts and upgrades to use the 1.2 upgrade system, correct?
<Agathorn>
or flip it around and maybe ris rewards doing certification flights
<Pap>
Agathorn: I could just build it into the contract system...
<Agathorn>
let'sz face it, in KSP it is pretty easy to jkust skip those without consequences
<Agathorn>
not like skipping it is going to make your crew more likely to die
<rsparkyc>
built in contract might be a good compromise
<Pap>
Create a contract that requires you to launch a craft with crewCapacity = 1 and crew on board = 0
<Agathorn>
Pap yeah maybe a contract that looks for a capsule with no one in it? That doable?
<Agathorn>
:)
<rsparkyc>
crew capacity > 0
<Agathorn>
yeah
<rsparkyc>
crew = 0
<Pap>
yes rsparkyc
<lamont>
rsparkyc: if you login to travis you can redo it, or as a submitter if close + re-open the PR it will kick off a new travis job (although it litters the PR a bit with close/open notifications)
<Agathorn>
OR do multiple ones for different capsules
<Bornholio>
historical has chimp/dog flights why not that
<Agathorn>
because that way you would have to do certs for larger capsules separaetely
<Pap>
Bornholio: my Historical Progression contract pack has the Korabl-Sputnik 2 with the dog and the Mercury-Redstone with Ham the Chimp. They are created as tourists and you have to launch the craft with them inside and return them home safely
<rsparkyc>
thx lamont
<Agathorn>
Laika
<Agathorn>
was the dogs name IIRC
<Bornholio>
poor Laika .sad
<Agathorn>
and man would the SPCA be pissed today
<Bornholio>
and Rus would still not care
<Pap>
No, it was the dog after Laika, actually Korabl-Sputnik 5 with the dog Zvezdochka
<NathanKell>
ooh tourist is the way to go! might need code to make them doglike though and tailor the death reputation hit
<Agathorn>
Bornholio: I wouldn't be so sure post glasnost or whatever it is called
<NathanKell>
Pap we do have to update eventually yes
<Pap>
Bornholio: both of the contracts are the final uncrewed flights of the Vostok and Mercury capsules
<Agathorn>
Today's world I think they have plenty of activists who would make just as much of a stink
<Pap>
ok NathanKell, that is what I thought
<lamont>
NathanKell: what would you think of a little “Powered Explicit Guidance” button on mechjeb?
<NathanKell>
I need (or someone needs) to rewrite RF to use it too
Agathorn is now known as Agathorn|Food
<NathanKell>
Lamont I would sing your praises to the stars
<NathanKell>
should be rather easier in MJ than in krpc anyway
<lamont>
i also seem to have fallen into a wormhole to a new universe full of the Saturn V iterative guidance mode for doing ascents and burns and such
<NathanKell>
:D
<lamont>
yeah i got kind of fed up with kOS and kRPC and just started writing code in C#, i need to dust off my own autopilot launcher and do some prototyping this weekend I think
<ferram4>
Well, the good news is that code like that is relatively simple to write.
<ferram4>
The bad news is that tuning the constants so it actually works is more of a pain.
<NathanKell>
yeah, the work you'll need to do is in part figuring out, based on lower stage SLT, dV, and time, what curve to fly for that too
<NathanKell>
well, and thermal limits :D
<ferram4>
And for upper stages, how much to pitch up/down, considering that earlier gravity losses might be lower than later steering losses and vice versa.
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<Pap>
NathanKell: where are the RCS Fuels tech levels set?
<NathanKell>
where the propellants unlock, or where the thruster TLs unlock?
<Pap>
Propellants
<NathanKell>
the propellants unlock in the stability subtree, the thrsuter TLs in the rocketry (regular) subtree
<NathanKell>
stabilty gives good monoprops, flight control gives biprop
<Pap>
Where are those unlocks stored? I cannot find them
<Pap>
The CFG file I mean
<NathanKell>
RO_RCS_Config in RO, I think?
<NathanKell>
yep
<NathanKell>
RO_Suggested\RO_RCS_Config.cfg
<Pap>
Ah, never looked in RO, assumed it was RP-0, thanks
<NathanKell>
we store engine CONFIG cost, entrycost, and tech required in RO...sadly
<NathanKell>
it's just so nice to have it in the engine global configs along with everything else, don't need multiple passes
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<NathanKell>
o/ leudaimon
<Pap>
Ah, so it is technically an Engine Config, that works well for me
<NathanKell>
yep, it is
<NathanKell>
in fact it's the first global engine config :)
<Pap>
:)
<leudaimon>
o/ NathanKell!
<Qboid>
leudaimon: NathanKell|WORK left a message for you in #RO [09.06.2017 23:47:31]: "no worries, you're playing a great game and are an inspiration to us all :)"
<Qboid>
leudaimon: NathanKell left a message for you in #RO [10.06.2017 03:34:37]: "so, question (and I guess you don't have to answer this :P ) --- are you planning to fly a test flight of your crewed launch, or just going all up at once? Because I'm now paranoid enough that I'm debating skipping the verification flight, but would feel very uncomfortable doing so and would only do so if you were also planning t
<Qboid>
o skip the dog/chimp flight"
<Pap>
NathanKell: LqdHydrogen doesnt unlock as a fuel option in a tank until HydroloxTL2, is that on purpose? What is supposed to be used for the first set of Hydrolox engines unlocked?
<leudaimon>
NathanKell, I didn't think about certification flight yet, but I'm pretty behind you to unlock the capsule
<leudaimon>
We can make a gentlemen agreement and both do the certification flight ;)
<NathanKell>
leudaimon: Sounds good to me :)
<leudaimon>
cool
<NathanKell>
Pap: Odd, it should unlock in General Construction IIRC
<NathanKell>
oh wait nm
<Pap>
The Cryogenic Tank unlocks in Advanced Construction
<NathanKell>
Cryogenic tanks I'm thinking of
<NathanKell>
and I'm off by a node anyway
<leudaimon>
I'll also try to incorporate the unlock costs of proc. avionics without going imediatelly bankrupt to make things more even, given you are not using procedurals
<NathanKell>
yes, LqdHydrogen doesn't unlock until you 'tame liquid hydrogen' by researching hydrolox
<NathanKell>
leudaimon: Ah, interesting point! Although it's only like, what, 15k for everything but Agena total, and 16 (20?) for Agena?
<NathanKell>
so it's not that big an advantage
<leudaimon>
rsparkyc put high prices for the procedurals apparently
<NathanKell>
Pap: I'd be happier with it unlocking in the bluesky node for that level actually
<NathanKell>
so you can do fuel cells without hydrolox engines
<leudaimon>
he said he spent 100k for all tech unlocking when he put that in his game
<NathanKell>
...ah, wow. Ok
<leudaimon>
I thought it a little high
<NathanKell>
Oh, right, the early controllable core
<NathanKell>
that's another 20 mil
<NathanKell>
(IIRC)
<leudaimon>
yep
<leudaimon>
I'll have to have the money to do that immediately (which I do not have) or I won't be able to build anything to get the money
<rsparkyc>
i just accepted some lunar contracts
<rsparkyc>
that gave me the cash to buy them
<rsparkyc>
i'm also not winning :)
<leudaimon>
no more lunar contracts for me to accept, just the lander I already have
<leudaimon>
rsparkyc, sorry to break your hopes, but if I don't have a failure I'll beat you for GEO by 5 days
<rsparkyc>
don't fail me now agathorn
<leudaimon>
(I'm not commiting to moon rovers or sample return just yet)
<NathanKell>
oh since you're going to GEO I'm safe on capsules \o/
<NathanKell>
question is who will get to Venus first? Window and all. Paging soundnfury :)
<NathanKell>
it's whoever can push the most delta V I guess, for a faster transit
<leudaimon>
lol NathanKell may be true... assuming everyone has the antenna on time
<NathanKell>
yeah
<leudaimon>
I have the GEO rocket ready to launch
<leudaimon>
but techwise I'm behind
<rsparkyc>
i could get there, just don't have the antenna
<leudaimon>
I bought the R&D building upgrade, which I think now that was very stupid
<leudaimon>
should have taken the VAB first
<rsparkyc>
still have a procedural avionics bug, when you shrink the size of the part, it will lower your controllable avionics instead of capping it, wonder if i could fix that real quick...
<NathanKell>
RP-0 runs on Valve Time now, you have time :D
<rsparkyc>
lol
<Pap>
Damn, we might get the tree included at this rate ;)
<rsparkyc>
NathanKell, can you say what you're doing there?
<NathanKell>
Alas no. But Gabe did announce we're working on quite a few new games
<rsparkyc>
well, whatever it is, hope it's fun
<NathanKell>
We do too! :)
<rsparkyc>
lol
<leudaimon>
NathanKell, how are you doing your capsule service module without service module tanks?
<lamont>
i thought we were good until RP-2 episode 3
<Pap>
NathanKell: in the RFTechLevels.cfg file, it sets the RF TechLevels by EngineType. One is ~name[N] and the other is #name[S], what are those referring to?
<xShadowx>
name field of that node, # exists, ~ doesnt, so #name[S] = has a field called 'name' with the value 'S'
<xShadowx>
why S and N i dont know :D
<leudaimon>
[S] is for solids IIRC
<Pap>
leudaimon: that makes sense for what I am seeing, I wonder what the N stands for
<leudaimon>
RCS?
<Pap>
That would make sense as well
<NathanKell>
sorry, was getting dinner served
<leudaimon>
I think those are the only "engines" that use tech levels
<NathanKell>
leudaimon: Fuselage is highly pressurized
<NathanKell>
lamont hah
<leudaimon>
oh yeah, just a ton heavy
<NathanKell>
Pap: nuclear and solid
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<Pap>
Nuclear? Why Nuclear?
<leudaimon>
nuclear engines have tech levels?!
<leudaimon>
lol
<Bornholio>
nuclear before hydrolox in the us, pumping coolwhip was a NTR technology (liquid hydrogen)
<NathanKell|NOMZ>
rf supports tech levels for them yes
<Pap>
Where is the CFG with the Tech Levels for the RCS set?
<NathanKell|NOMZ>
rp0's rf techlevels file in root IIRC
<Pap>
That means the that @ENGINETYPE,*:HAS[~name[N]] has to be for RCS engines, not nuclear as there are only that and the solids ones configged in that file
<Pap>
Actually, based on what I am seeing, they are not actually configged in RP-0, they are pulling their data directly from RealFuels config for name = L ENGIENTYPE
<NathanKell|NOMZ>
if there were any engines that did use tech levels other than rcs (say rf stock alike)
<NathanKell|NOMZ>
then they would use that
* xShadowx
nomz on nacho
<NathanKell|NOMZ>
correct that's how tech levels system works
<Pap>
ok
<leudaimon>
but what tech tree does RF assume to apply the tech levels?
<Pap>
leudaimon: it is stock, but with the nodes it is using, it makes sense for RP-0 as well
<Pap>
I am adding the Tech Levels for RCS for the new tree as they are vastly different that the stock tree
<leudaimon>
oh, I see
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<leudaimon>
never understood why the RP-0 tech tree is this thing in between stock and not-stock
<Pap>
leudaimon: I think it was the time required to create a new one was HUGE and they were interested / focused on other parts of it
<leudaimon>
yeah, probably... i just find it confusing, especially the node names different from what is shown ingame
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<NathanKell>
sorry, back
<NathanKell>
Basically the idea behind RF at the time was to broadly model realistic engine progression across any set of fictional engines
<NathanKell>
so you could have a set of upgrades for any given engine config
<NathanKell>
and balanced mass for its performance, too
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<leudaimon>
cool
<NathanKell>
I released that, like, the day before the first bit of KSP career mode released
<NathanKell>
heh
<NathanKell>
anyway, it's basically unused by RO except for 'generic' engines
<NathanKell>
but if RF Stockalike still exists, that used it on everything
<NathanKell>
RF was set up to use the stock tree, RP-0 patches it to use the RP-0 modifications of the rocketry path
<NathanKell>
(each 'type' of engine had its own set of values--L for bosoter, L+ for sustainer, U for upper, U+ for high-perf upper, O for pfed orbital taxi stuff, N for nuclear, etc)
<NathanKell>
as to why we based off the stock tree (or rather CTT), well, we originally didn't think we'd have to change that much, and pjf was a gigantic believer in cross-mod compatibility (and I think naively hoped we could just roll with existing CTT node assignments for parts)
<NathanKell>
but we went in a more realistic (and, uh, detail-oriented) direction
<NathanKell>
by the time I was rewriting half the early tree (note, also, KSP's own tree changed a few times around then >.> ) I had enough work invested there I didn't want to redo it
<Pap>
Yeah, it gets to a point when you are too far into one thing to back all the way out
<NathanKell>
Sunk-through-the-floor costs
<Pap>
then I come along and run everything
<Pap>
/s/run/ruin
<leudaimon>
yeah, the current early tree is not bad, just find it so confusing this naming thing and mix of stuff
<Pap>
^did that wrong
<NathanKell>
s/ruin/rule/
<NathanKell>
the naming's a dev problem not user problem thankfully :)
<NathanKell>
user doesn't see the internal names
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<NathanKell>
Ok, think Imma stream a bit of Glorious Soviet Space Progam (much STRONK)
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<Pap>
Alright, I am headed to bed, goodnight all
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<NathanKell|Twitch>
Night! :)
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<leudaimon>
night!
<leudaimon>
!tell Pap don't you think the margin for GEO is too high? it completed when my periapsis was at 32Mm, and the orbital period was not even close to 1 sidereal day
<Qboid>
leudaimon: I'll redirect this as soon as they are around.
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<leudaimon>
!tell Pap also, the atmospheric analysis satellite did not complete when I made the experiments
<Qboid>
leudaimon: I'll redirect this as soon as they are around.
<leudaimon>
!tell Pap oh, nvm, I was in space high
<Qboid>
leudaimon: I'll redirect this as soon as they are around.
<leudaimon>
night!
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<acharles>
Agathorn|Food: Yeah, there weren’t any configs and it works for other engines. And it works for the Aerobee, for example.
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<acharles>
Aren’t any stock configs, only RO configs
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<soundnfury>
!tell leudaimon,NathanKell* yeah I was planning on a capsule cert flight too, I think we absolutely should. And I like the idea of making a contract for it. As for RtS, it could count total deaths maybe?
<Qboid>
soundnfury: I'll redirect this as soon as they are around.
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<soundnfury>
!tell NathanKell* I was really hoping no-one else would notice that Venus window until it was too late, then you went and showed it on your stream :|
<Qboid>
soundnfury: I'll redirect this as soon as they are around.
<soundnfury>
!tell NathanKell* /me has been planning around making sure everything was ready for that since back when doing lunar flyby shots
<Qboid>
soundnfury: I'll redirect this as soon as they are around.
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<soundnfury>
!tell Pap I wonder if the Crew Count records (maybe after 1) should require orbit. 'Cos I think right now you _could_ just lob a cockpit full of guys on a suborbital trajectory and get a ton of money
<Qboid>
soundnfury: I'll redirect this as soon as they are around.
<soundnfury>
RIS folks: don't do that ^^^
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<soundnfury>
hmm, in KerbalRoster.GetFooCrewCount(), what's the difference between Foo={KIA, Lost, Missing}?
* soundnfury
will probably have to do some experimental testing to find out
<soundnfury>
killing kerbals... for Science!
<egg|afk|egg>
soundnfury: does !tell with a comma work?
<egg|afk|egg>
!tell egg,uovo foo
<Qboid>
egg|afk|egg: I'll redirect this as soon as they are around.
egg|afk|egg is now known as egg
<egg>
foo
<Qboid>
egg: egg|afk|egg left a message for you in #RO [10.06.2017 11:10:36]: "foo"
egg is now known as uovo
<uovo>
foo
<Qboid>
uovo: egg|afk|egg left a message for you in #RO [10.06.2017 11:10:36]: "foo"
<uovo>
soundnfury: apparently.
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<soundnfury>
egg: yeah, someone taught me that one a couple of days ago
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<SigmaAway>
!wpn uovo
* Qboid
gives uovo a grass snake
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<HypergolicSkunk>
can someone please test whether the Otter cockpit has IVA? doesn't work for me :(
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<HypergolicSkunk>
hi stratochief o/ do you happen to have the DHC-3 Otter cockpit in your install?
Pap|Sleep is now known as Pap
<Pap>
Hi soundnfury
<Qboid>
Pap: leudaimon left a message for you in #RO [10.06.2017 05:58:43]: "don't you think the margin for GEO is too high? it completed when my periapsis was at 32Mm, and the orbital period was not even close to 1 sidereal day"
<Qboid>
Pap: leudaimon left a message for you in #RO [10.06.2017 06:03:10]: "also, the atmospheric analysis satellite did not complete when I made the experiments"
<Qboid>
Pap: leudaimon left a message for you in #RO [10.06.2017 06:04:48]: "oh, nvm, I was in space high"
<Qboid>
Pap: soundnfury left a message for you in #RO [10.06.2017 10:57:24]: "I wonder if the Crew Count records (maybe after 1) should require orbit. 'Cos I think right now you _could_ just lob a cockpit full of guys on a suborbital trajectory and get a ton of money"
<Pap>
!tell leudaimon The deviation window for the first GEO satellite might be too high. It was set that way since it is a relatively "early" contract. Maybe I should shrink it down? I don't know how much changing the value affects the margin however
<Qboid>
Pap: I'll redirect this as soon as they are around.
<HypergolicSkunk>
hey Pap o/
<Pap>
o/ HypergolicSkunk
<Pap>
HypergolicSkunk: ready to start a new career?
<HypergolicSkunk>
:'( all the work I put into the comsats...
<Pap>
:) they are beautiful
<HypergolicSkunk>
but so time-intensive to set up
<HypergolicSkunk>
oh well :) why a new career?
<Pap>
If this loading test goes well, the new tech tree will be ready to test
<HypergolicSkunk>
<3
<HypergolicSkunk>
I am wondering.. does your tech-tree include positions for Forgotten Real Engines?
<Pap>
yes it dies HypergolicSkunk
<Pap>
*does
<HypergolicSkunk>
cool. I'll be happy to continue playing and smoking w--------- testing!
<HypergolicSkunk>
how do you like my Antonov An-2, Pap ? :P I wish Procedural Wings had some shape options for rounded off edges .. http://imgur.com/a/sFIU6
<Pap>
HypergolicSkunk: you /do/ make some pretty looking planes!
<HypergolicSkunk>
thank you :D
<TheKosmonaut>
!seen Regex
<Qboid>
TheKosmonaut: I last saw regex on [09.06.2017 17:09:51] in #RO saying: "Np"
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<Pap>
hey rsparkyc
<rsparkyc>
o/
<rsparkyc>
only on for about 5 minutes
<rsparkyc>
should probably set an AFK flag
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<Pap>
lol
<rsparkcy|AFK>
:)
<acc>
hey Pap, rsparkcy
<acc>
:>
<Pap>
o/ acc
<Pap>
The new tree works!
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<HypergolicSkunk>
nice!
<Pap>
Here you go everyone. Nothing is balanced, all of the tech costs are guesses, please report back your findings!
<Qboid>
leudaimon: soundnfury left a message for you in #RO [10.06.2017 10:39:45]: "yeah I was planning on a capsule cert flight too, I think we absolutely should. And I like the idea of making a contract for it. As for RtS, it could count total deaths maybe?"
<Qboid>
leudaimon: Pap left a message for you in #RO [10.06.2017 13:48:44]: "The deviation window for the first GEO satellite might be too high. It was set that way since it is a relatively "early" contract. Maybe I should shrink it down? I don't know how much changing the value affects the margin however"
<leudaimon>
Pap, about the GEO contract, if possible I think the best option is to let the orbital parameters with this level of flexibility, but add a requirement for orbital period in the range of 5-10 minutes of a sidereal day
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<leudaimon>
Pap, no more yaml perl script right?
<Theysen>
hey guys , hey Pap
<Theysen>
where exactly do i dl the new tree? I got the excel file
<leudaimon>
cool, no significant increase in MM passes with the new tech tree
<Theysen>
CTT is still needed?
<Theysen>
My memories may fail me but didn't I read Pap got rid of that dependancy? Might be a different mod
<leudaimon>
I would expcet that no, but apparently it is not a conflict also
<leudaimon>
Pap, do you have a list of which mods you already integrated? Also, other things you already know are still to be done?
Agathorn|Food is now known as Agathorn
<Agathorn>
heh oops I never changed my status after dinner last night
<acc>
Pap: yay for new tree :)
<acc>
hullu Agathorn
<Agathorn>
morning acc
<acc>
and hey Theysen and leudaimon
<Agathorn>
trying to decide if I want to go to a Mummy screening this morning or not
<acc>
what's that?
<leudaimon>
o/ acc
<Agathorn>
My company worked on The Mummy and they are doing a free screening of it at the thater this morning for us
<Agathorn>
theater*
<acc>
oh, ok
<Agathorn>
but its at 9:45 which means I would have to go soon, and i'm not sure I really want to watch it to be honest :)
<Agathorn>
at least not ion a theater on a st urday morning
<acc>
yeah, not the best movie series
<Agathorn>
well this isn't in any way connected to the previous -- well other than being the same property
<acc>
oh, ok. interesting
<Agathorn>
though the reviews have been pretty bad anyway :) It is yet another company (Universal) trying to start up a Cinematic Universe (In this case based around Universal's old Monsters) because If Marvel Can Do It...
<Pap>
leudaimon: correct, no more perl script
<Pap>
leudaimon: every mod that has configs for RO is included in the tree (if there is anything missing, polease let me know)
<Pap>
Theysen: CTT needs to be removed from the install
<acc>
Agathorn: I don't think that will work out well heh
<acc>
but duno. my taste is probably not the most representative one
<leudaimon>
Pap, I see some stuff lacking, but will remove CTT before reporting what I saw lacking
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<Theysen>
damn I CTD with the new rp-0 folder and without CTT
<Theysen>
there shouldn't be any reason for that
<HypergolicSkunk>
I still think that there's something wrong with the CoM calculation in 1.2.2 with Procedural Wings.. the fuel for this plane is all near the cockpit, neither the Bonanza Tail nor the Rudder/Elevon structure has any fuel in it... http://i.imgur.com/1ryQhLv.png
<Theysen>
third time it works. *magic* as usual
<HypergolicSkunk>
as soon as I take the structure away, the CoM is reasonable
<HypergolicSkunk>
also, wth did I just build there :D
<Theysen>
Pap, instant question :P where did the WAC corporal from the Taerobee mod go in the starting node? :P :P
<Theysen>
and for some reason my R&D screen lags the crap out
<Agathorn>
Theysen: so many problems! Almost sounds like maybe an install issue
<Theysen>
nah definitely not :)
<Agathorn>
when multiple things start going wrong that is usually where my thinking goes
<Agathorn>
pft everyone can make mistakes :)
<Agathorn>
like maybe you accidenallty have the old tree in there as well?
<Agathorn>
wow IRFNA is dense
<Theysen>
Agathorn, I am 100% confident I installed it correctly this time :P it might just be the sheer gigantic size of the tree
<Agathorn>
ok :)
<leudaimon>
had no issues with lag here Theysen
<leudaimon>
about the WAC, it's really misplaced... the parts from Taerobee are not in the starting node
<leudaimon>
while the "stock" one is
<Theysen>
leudaimon, is the scond node after post-war-rocketry empty for you too? Early Rocketry
<leudaimon>
yep, but the XASR-1 unlocks there, and I think some of the RD-100 series also
<HypergolicSkunk>
Theysen: it isn't empty for me, but I also activated the savegame option to not display empty nodes
<leudaimon>
so you might not have the node we are talking about HypergolicSkunk
<Agathorn>
hey guys.. is hydrazine a hypergol?
<Theysen>
Agathorn, yup
<HypergolicSkunk>
which means that node doesn't show up at all. for me, it's like this: Post-War Rocketry, Basic Rocketry, 1956-1957 Orbital Rocketry
<Agathorn>
thanks!
<HypergolicSkunk>
leudaimon: yep
<Agathorn>
so wait if the node doesn't show up for you, how do you research it for the engine unlocks?
<HypergolicSkunk>
you don't. :)
<Agathorn>
or even to advance to the next node in the series?
<HypergolicSkunk>
(need to)
<Agathorn>
it just autounlocks?
<HypergolicSkunk>
it isn't visible, so it isn't even considered
<leudaimon>
it doesn't make much sense for me also... balance-wise
<HypergolicSkunk>
spending science for empty nodes seems ... counterintuitive
<Agathorn>
so RF just unlocks those engines for you.. when? When you research the previous node?
<Agathorn>
but it isn't "empty" it just is empy in R&D
<Theysen>
but it has this line in the tree: hideEmpty = False doesn't this disable the hide empty nodes feature?
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<Agathorn>
RF really needs to put dummy models for upgrades into those
<leudaimon>
Agathorn, that is being worked upon IIRC
<Agathorn>
cool
<Bornholio>
is Pap 's new tech tree in the current master?
<leudaimon>
Pap, I added my first impressions on rp0#667
<Qboid>
[#667] title: Blue Skies Research Based Tech Tree | Some of you have been playing around with the tech tree that I made and have provided great feedback on it. As I have played through it, there have been some nice things and there have been some things that feel clunky with it. After some discussions with @NathanKell and @stratochief66 we discussed some ideas on how to improve things. I have
<Bornholio>
Leudaimon isn't a tiny 3watt cell in the game already, little square thing. I'll peek in game and see what its called
<leudaimon>
Bornholio, maybe it's FASA? The point is, I think there could be a progression from something like that to the ST1 solar panel
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<lamont>
heh KRASH has TF failures
<Pap>
Got it leudaimon
<Bornholio>
you are correct its a FASA panel. 3.15w, FASASolarMini
<leudaimon>
good to know Bornholio
<leudaimon>
oh, just noticed I forgot to sync RtS to grab the first GEO yesterday
<Pap>
leudaimon: I have a long (and probably boring) response to your post on RP-0#667
<Qboid>
[#667] title: Blue Skies Research Based Tech Tree | Some of you have been playing around with the tech tree that I made and have provided great feedback on it. As I have played through it, there have been some nice things and there have been some things that feel clunky with it. After some discussions with @NathanKell and @stratochief66 we discussed some ideas on how to improve things. I have
<leudaimon>
Pap, I generally agree with your points. About the RD-100 I have rechecked before writing, but I'll take a look later. The strange thing is that the other engines of this mod are available
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<Theysen>
leudaimon, wow I just wanted to give some feedback on the early tree as far as I just got and you "ninja'd" me haha, thanks for saving me some typing time!
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<NathanKell>
o/
<Qboid>
NathanKell: soundnfury left a message for you in #RO [10.06.2017 10:39:45]: "yeah I was planning on a capsule cert flight too, I think we absolutely should. And I like the idea of making a contract for it. As for RtS, it could count total deaths maybe?"
<Qboid>
NathanKell: soundnfury left a message for you in #RO [10.06.2017 10:40:25]: "I was really hoping no-one else would notice that Venus window until it was too late, then you went and showed it on your stream :|"
<Qboid>
NathanKell: soundnfury left a message for you in #RO [10.06.2017 10:41:16]: "/me has been planning around making sure everything was ready for that since back when doing lunar flyby shots"
<NathanKell>
Pap, stratochief, soundnfury (et al): I can't remember why I didn't require orbit for space crew count records. Maybe should. Certainly doing so by count2 is a reasonable compromise.
<NathanKell>
soundnfury: sorry about highlighitng the window :]
<NathanKell>
soundnfury: You can always pay a lil' extra delta V and launch early on a fast transit
<xShadowx>
o/
<soundnfury>
o/ NathanKell
<NathanKell>
Actually now that I think about it, Crew Count 1 makes no sense. We should just split its reward between Crewed Karman and Crewed Orbit
<NathanKell>
Pap ^
<NathanKell>
(and make the Count record require orbit)
<soundnfury>
NathanKell: what's the difference between CrewRoster.GetKIACrewCount() and CrewRoster.GetLostCrewCount()?
<NathanKell>
KIA means they actually died. Lost/MIA means they were on a vessel that was killed during gameload (i.e. had missing parts)
<NathanKell>
IIRC.
<soundnfury>
right, I probably want to use KIA then
<soundnfury>
ty
<NathanKell>
yep
<NathanKell>
:)
<NathanKell>
Pap: I gotta step away for a bit but will comment on the tree when I get back :)
NathanKell is now known as NathanKell|AFK
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<Pap>
soundnfury: I am pretty sure that a Kerbal is also considered Lost when you have crew members that respawn (basically the difficulty setting where crew respawns on death)
<egg>
!wpn NathanKell|AFK
* Qboid
gives NathanKell|AFK an enriched power supply
<soundnfury>
Pap: yeah but who's gonna play RO with that setting on :P
<Pap>
:)
<Pap>
soundnfury: did you see some of the back chat ideas that we had for using reputation as a multiplier for rewards?
<soundnfury>
yeah, but I'm not sure about that
<soundnfury>
too complicated :D
<Pap>
It is for sure
<leudaimon>
reputation in RP-0 goes up incredibly fast right now...
<Pap>
leudaimon: it is an unused value, nothing is affected by it
<leudaimon>
sure... that's why I never raised that... but if it starts getting used for rewards
<leudaimon>
I never quite understood why it was added even to stock
<Pap>
leudaimon: it used to affect which level of contracts were offered, but Contract Configurator changed that
<Pap>
What can it be used for? There has to be something useful that it can be used fore
<Pap>
*for
<leudaimon>
oh, I heard about that when CC changed that, but never noticed
<Pap>
Then we will look at the rewards and penalties with it
<leudaimon>
point is, unless you are doing silly things, reputation only goes up
<Pap>
correct
<Pap>
I think something like State Funding or Monthly Budgets mod added to RO would be greaet
<leudaimon>
I could see reputation working if there was a periodic budget you received
<Pap>
CAnnot type today
<leudaimon>
lol
<Pap>
lol
<Pap>
!tell NathanKell|AFK yes, I agree with the CrewCount 1 reward not making sense. I will combine that into the two contracts and then create some pre-requisites on the other ones
<Qboid>
Pap: I'll redirect this as soon as they are around.
<Pap>
leudaimon: does the RD-100 from Ven's show up in the tree?
<leudaimon>
yep
<leudaimon>
I'm opening my test install to make sure the realengines one does not appear
<leudaimon>
soundnfury, I think it is RtS that is causing cache reload everytime, my test install of the new tree with everything else equal loads the cache
<leudaimon>
Pap, no RD-100 from realengines, only Ven's
<soundnfury>
leudaimon: sounds improbable! The only data I save is in the Scenario node
<soundnfury>
(unless there's some window position saving in the code I ripped off from RemoteTech, but I doubt it)
<leudaimon>
strange, I only erased RIS and CTT folders
<soundnfury>
fairly sure I've been getting loads from cache no problem
<SpecimenSpiff>
gah, im really starting to hate baikonur. so hard to get biomes...
<Pap>
ok, then there is something wrong with the RO config for it
<Pap>
Can anyone confirm that in the old tree the RealEngines RD100 showed up?
<Pap>
be back later
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<leudaimon>
I used those in my RtS game
<soundnfury>
ummm, I've just realised that I think milestone completions are only picked up when you sync, and they get the date you synced
<soundnfury>
so make sure you always sync as soon as you complete a thing!
<leudaimon>
oh, good to know... is it easy to fix?
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<soundnfury>
leudaimon: I'm not sure
<soundnfury>
trying to remember how to get at completed contracts right now
NathanKell|AFK is now known as NathanKell
<NathanKell>
o/
<leudaimon>
just to shut my mouth KSP loaded the cache now soundnfury
<NathanKell>
I think PR and KAC are the big culprits there
<NathanKell>
unless either got changed
<leudaimon>
I thought PR had fixed that NathanKell
<NathanKell>
ah awesome
<NathanKell>
yep looks like
<soundnfury>
NathanKell: streaming tonight?
<NathanKell>
yes, gonna try earlier
<NathanKell>
it being Saturday
<soundnfury>
what sort of time?
* soundnfury
needs a bath but doesn't want to miss the stream
<Theysen>
tablet? combine both :D
<NathanKell>
Probably 30 minutes. Just finishing up a comment for Pap|AFK
<soundnfury>
right, then I'll work on the mod for a bit, leave bathing till later :D
<soundnfury>
who wants to be _clean_ anyway :P
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<Pap>
leudaimon: still around?
<Pap>
I figured out the RD100 issue
<NathanKell>
\o/
<NathanKell>
Pap: Btw left a novel for you on the issue. I think it might need another node tho :( Would love to hear your feedback on that, as I think early on engines are the most critical...
<leudaimon>
hey Pap
<leudaimon>
semi around
* leudaimon
goes read NathanKell's novel
<NathanKell>
Ah, my novel is shorter than your novel :D
<lamont>
i’m working on improving the auto-ullage/prevent-restarts code
<lamont>
then i think i’ll get to play with powered explicit guidance
<NathanKell>
\o/
<NathanKell>
\o/ \o/
<soundnfury>
NathanKell: once upon a time there was a little sausage called Baldrick. The end.
NathanKell is now known as NathanKell|Twitch
<NathanKell|Twitch>
sorry, I don't recall the context on that one :\
<soundnfury>
Ink & Incapability, series 3, Samuel Johnson's Dictionary
<soundnfury>
leudaimon: just tested my fix and it works, next version of RIS will do it right :)
<leudaimon>
cool soundnfury :)
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<xShadowx>
do antenna have any difficulty transmitting during re entry when you're surrounded by firey fun?
<xShadowx>
or any effect?
<Bornholio>
if plasma occlusion is on yes
<xShadowx>
either RT or stock
<xShadowx>
o.O
<xShadowx>
thats in RT i assume?
<Bornholio>
Comnet also
<xShadowx>
and thats diff than just atmosphere occlusion?
<xShadowx>
accually takes firey effects in account?
<xShadowx>
:)
<Bornholio>
It has an option switch in the comnet section
<xShadowx>
mmk
<soundnfury>
bornholio: I believe that's only stock comms, not RT, that's affected by that
<soundnfury>
So, I'm adding a notion of milestone 'tiers', so that if you complete two firsts on the same day, and one's obviously better than the other, that's the one you get paid for
<soundnfury>
e.g. lunar flyby and orbiter
<Starwaster>
Could the Apollo Guidance Computer actually take over the IU's iterative guidance mode if the IU failed?
<xShadowx>
soundnfury: i found where ksp stores 'firsts', could even make your own :D
<xShadowx>
that said, theres a 'buzz the tower' first :P dont need everything to be serious
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<Bornholio>
soundnfury man correct my brain i had to go look that up, my brain was sure it did.
<Starwaster>
Negatiev xshadowx, the pattern is full
<xShadowx>
Starwaster: y ur mes ge s ga l d ca not der and